[home][rumors and news][model release matrix][dealer network][desktop calendar][exhaust notes][tov forums][links][search][sponsors][garage][login]

Tire Rack Upgrade Garage
 Search for a Dealer:
 Canadian Flag US Flag
 Honda Acura
 ZIP  
This 2019 Acura RDX A-Spec is wearing an exclusive new shade of blue
More.......................
2019 Pilot gets upgraded with standard LED headlights and "Telematics"
More.......................
Sources: 2019 HR-V adds Sport trim, loses 6MT option
More.......................
All-new 2019 Acura RDX Makes Road Debut as Official Vehicle of Rally Cycling Alongside NSX Supercar
More.......................
Clarity Electric still available for $199/month lease, but down payment has increased $600
More.......................
Driving impressions: Hondata's FlashPro for the FK8 Civic Type R
More.......................
American Honda Reports April Sales Results
More.......................
Honda reveals Everus EV Concept at Beijing International Auto Show
More.......................
General Talk --> Re: I just realized
Join Discussion......
NSX --> Re: 2020 NSX Type-R
Join Discussion......
Today's Reading Links --> Re: Electricity Supplies tight in Calimestan
Join Discussion......
Civic --> Re: 2019 Civic MMC rumors?
Join Discussion......
General Talk --> Re: Porsche Macan S weight distro: 56.7/43.3
Join Discussion......
General Talk --> Re: Drove the new Mazda 6 Signature with 2.5 Skyactiv Turbo today
Join Discussion......
General Talk --> Re: Electronic rear view mirrors - one thing I don't like
Join Discussion......
RDX --> Re: 2019 RDX Trim Levels
Join Discussion......
Fuel Cell Technology --> Re: Beat a Mirai to the H2 station last night New style H70 pumps
Join Discussion......
Professional Motorsports --> Re: F1 - 2018 Spanish Grand Prix
Join Discussion......
Today's Reading Links --> Re: Tesla - facts behind the mirage
Join Discussion......
Type R --> Re: Mishimoto Catch Can - What For?
Join Discussion......
Professional Motorsports --> Re: Moto GP Spoiler
Join Discussion......
Professional Motorsports --> Re: 2018 Indy 500
Join Discussion......
Type R --> Re: Spare Wheel Kit: Damaged Wheel
Join Discussion......
Photo Gallery - Some other cars from 2019 NYIAS
Read Article....................
TOV Video: 2019 Acura RDX Walk-around with LPL Steve Hansen
Read Article....................
TOV Photo Gallery: 2018 North American International Auto Show
Read Article....................
2018 Acura RLX PR Photo Gallery
Read Article....................
TOV First Drive: 2018 Honda Accord
Read Article....................
2018 Honda Accord Specifications and Features (FINAL)
Read Article....................

[fancy] [flat] [simple]
  TOV News > 2008 Should be a Happy New Year for Honda and Acura > > Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX

Viewing Threshold (What is this?)

Thread Page - [1]
Author
    
CanadaCraig
Profile for CanadaCraig
My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-03-2008 18:52
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
Hi Guys!! :)

I hope you're OK.

What with Nissan having a car that can reach 60 MPH in less than 3.5 seconds and Lexus - well - read the following from autocar.co.uk

The king is dead, long live the king! Lexus’ long-awaited LF-A has unofficially smashed the lap record at Germany’s Nürburgring, with a time of seven minutes, 24 seconds. That beats Porsche’s new GT2 by a second and makes the Lexus the King of the ’Ring. Company insiders have revealed that a 4.8-litre V10 – co-developed with Yamaha – powered the record-breaking test mule. It revs to 9,000rpm and pumps out 552bhp. Combined with a highly aerodynamic body, it should enable the LF-A to hit 210mph.

Should Honda even bother trying to create an NSX replacement? I think they've blown it. And with both of their 'flagship' vehicles - the RL [Legend] and the now dead NSX. I just don't think Honda has it in them to allow their 'right brains' to create something people WANT. And now it's all but too late. As for the NSX - it was a fantastic car way back in 1991. But Honda basically let it rot on the vine. And the Legend became a dud the day they dropped it and created the RL. Sales of the RL are so pathetic that Acura rarely even mentions them. And no wonder. Honda allowed Lexus to beat them at their own game and they refused to step up to the plate. NOW Acura will be lucky if they can build a more respected 'flagship' car than Hyundai. Shame on them - I say. And just how could Honda compete performance and/or value wise with either the new Lexus LF-A or the Nissan GT-R? They can't - as I see it. They haven't got the 'name' to compete with Lexus and they won't be able to compete with Nissan on price. I say - forget the 'next NSX' and build a RWD super-luxury V8 [Or even V10] SEDAN. And bring BACK the 'Legend' name [Obviously not many people love the RL 'name'] and TRY to impress upon customers that 'Acura' IS a 'luxury car'. If Honda is not willing to do whatever it takes then they should officially bow out and focus on selling vehicles that are nothing more than 'fancy Hondas'. In fact - maybe they should just scrap the Acura name and call every vehicle they sell 'Honda'.

Craig!! :)

PS HAPPY NEW YEAR TOV!!

NealX
Profile for NealX
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-03-2008 20:03
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
I don't think they can capture magic in a bottle twice...
aznstuart
Profile for aznstuart
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-03-2008 20:09
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
Quitting is never the answer...it's a last resort one takes after he's explored EVERY possible feasible option....something Acura has NOT done yet.

I say...replace all the management...start fresh...new models, new design language, new engines, new platforms, new pricing, new strategy, new THINKING, new FOCUS, new GOAL!

Oh, and make a new dealership re-membership program and training where all dealerships owners have to go to an Acura-organized training seminars. Then they go back to their dealership and apply changes up to par of what they learned at the seminar. In half a year, Acura will send out "SPY" representives to purchase a car from the dealership. They wouldn't know who was the rep. If they pass the test, then they get their membership, if they don't they can choose either to pay a hefty fine and try again, or sell their franchise back to Acura.

Over the years, Acura will periodically send out spies to each of their dealerships to make sure they are still in compliance with the set standards.

HondaChuck
Profile for HondaChuck
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2008 08:40
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
I agree with aznstuart, dont' give up yet. Look at Infiniti, they were an "also ran" for over a decade until they stepped up with RWD, high HP, excellent driving dynamics, and agressive marketing that have propelled them past their competitors in recent years. Infiniti has stolen the highest rated car (according to Consumer Reports) from Lexus and they have bested or equaled comparison tests against BMW and Mercedes.
Acura needs to take some of the insightful advice that TOVers offer and utilize the corporate talent that has crafted the many successes of Honda Motor Company.

Prox Enmity
Profile for Prox Enmity
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2008 09:40
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
Honda/Acura made the mistake A&G made...


They snubbed market trends and tried to force-feed people what they didn't want...


If you don't care about the bottom-line...fine...But, when people compare you to the "new kid on the block" and that new kid gives you everything you want, the winner is clear.


Lexus, and even Infiniti came out with V8 and RWD decades ago

Why are we still having this conversation in 2008?

ugh...TOo little/Too Late...


Maybe Honda should Kill Acura and create another Brand...

ever think of that? Just make Acura an intermediate model...Like

Yoiu come out of college and get a Honda...

Yoiu work 10 years...u get an Acura

Then, when yoiu're 45-50+...yoiu step up into Honda's New Ultra'Luxury Brand

Now...what do they call it?

Whatever they call it, don't put a F-N V6 and FWD in it.




Done.

cforez
Profile for cforez
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-04-2008 14:21
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
HondaChuck wrote:
Look at Infiniti, they were an "also ran" for over a decade until they stepped up with RWD, high HP, excellent driving dynamics, and agressive marketing that have propelled them past their competitors in recent years. Infiniti has stolen the highest rated car (according to Consumer Reports) from Lexus and they have bested or equaled comparison tests against BMW and Mercedes.


And despite all of that, Infiniti's sales are still off about 40% in comparison with a badly slumping Acura. :)

Infiniti
Dec 2007 Sales Total: 12,655
2007 Sales Total: 127,038

Acura
Dec 2007 Sales Total: 17,582
2007 Sales Total: 180,104

Apparently the sales of the Q45 flagship (V8, RWD) were so bad, Infiniti killed it. Honestly, I think the Q suffered from RL syndrome, not enough upgrade over a M.

Not to say that Acura doesn't have problems, like really poor new product spacing, but Acura hasn't exactly failed. I believe they're a RWD platform away from a Cadillac-like rebirth. It's not like Acura ever produced something like the Cimarron, so the climb to the top should be a lot easier, haha.

The Cadillac Cimarron:


It will still be tough for all the luxury brands in the current craptastic economic environment, though.

LF-A notwithstanding, as long as Toyota can't consistantly beat Honda on the track, (the Toyota/Ferrari F1 car doesn't count =O), I'll hold on to the belief that Honda is sandbagging when it comes to production cars. :P
















98 Accord
Profile for 98 Accord
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-08-2008 15:22
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
Acura just needs all the TOVers to work for them lol Im sure we can all do a better job, at least in most cases.
Seriously, Acura is not out of the game just yet. They just have to dig themselves out a hole, a REALLY big hole, start taking everything seriously and freshen up a huge amount of things. Time is definitely against them and their competitors are taking advantage of it.

shingles
Profile for shingles
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-10-2008 12:54
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
98 Accord wrote:
Acura just needs all the TOVers to work for them lol Im sure we can all do a better job, at least in most cases.
Seriously, Acura is not out of the game just yet. They just have to dig themselves out a hole, a REALLY big hole, start taking everything seriously and freshen up a huge amount of things. Time is definitely against them and their competitors are taking advantage of it.


Yeah and if TOV'ers worked for them, then their sales numbers would really be down because the cars that will be produced will only appears to a very limited car buying population.

lexusgs
Profile for lexusgs
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-13-2008 03:57
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
CanadaCraig wrote:
Hi Guys!! :)

I hope you're OK.

What with Nissan having a car that can reach 60 MPH in less than 3.5 seconds and Lexus - well - read the following from autocar.co.uk

The king is dead, long live the king! Lexus’ long-awaited LF-A has unofficially smashed the lap record at Germany’s Nürburgring, with a time of seven minutes, 24 seconds. That beats Porsche’s new GT2 by a second and makes the Lexus the King of the ’Ring. Company insiders have revealed that a 4.8-litre V10 – co-developed with Yamaha – powered the record-breaking test mule. It revs to 9,000rpm and pumps out 552bhp. Combined with a highly aerodynamic body, it should enable the LF-A to hit 210mph.

Should Honda even bother trying to create an NSX replacement? I think they've blown it. And with both of their 'flagship' vehicles - the RL [Legend] and the now dead NSX. I just don't think Honda has it in them to allow their 'right brains' to create something people WANT. And now it's all but too late. As for the NSX - it was a fantastic car way back in 1991. But Honda basically let it rot on the vine. And the Legend became a dud the day they dropped it and created the RL. Sales of the RL are so pathetic that Acura rarely even mentions them. And no wonder. Honda allowed Lexus to beat them at their own game and they refused to step up to the plate. NOW Acura will be lucky if they can build a more respected 'flagship' car than Hyundai. Shame on them - I say. And just how could Honda compete performance and/or value wise with either the new Lexus LF-A or the Nissan GT-R? They can't - as I see it. They haven't got the 'name' to compete with Lexus and they won't be able to compete with Nissan on price. I say - forget the 'next NSX' and build a RWD super-luxury V8 [Or even V10] SEDAN. And bring BACK the 'Legend' name [Obviously not many people love the RL 'name'] and TRY to impress upon customers that 'Acura' IS a 'luxury car'. If Honda is not willing to do whatever it takes then they should officially bow out and focus on selling vehicles that are nothing more than 'fancy Hondas'. In fact - maybe they should just scrap the Acura name and call every vehicle they sell 'Honda'.

Craig!! :)

PS HAPPY NEW YEAR TOV!!



Good post, and yes I feel Acura is in danger if they don't make some changes soon of being written off as just making fancier Accords and Pilots then a true luxury make. The thing is Acura did not really need rwd or v8s back in the day because their six cylinders were very good and putting out numbers close to the competitions v8. 40K Legends were selling well and were very highly rated against rwd v8 competition. The competition and Acura were not putting a ton of horsepower to the wheels so fwd was not that big of a deal. The past couple of years though the competition is putting down serious horsepower 320hp+ with v8s where SOHC v6 can't compete anymore and it is too much power for fwd, even 300hp+ v6 are too much for fwd. Honda has tried to remedy this with SHAWD but it has not been used in any high performance 300+hp vehicles so the jury is out if this is the answer.

It does not seem that Acura wants to make this change to v8s, rwd platforms, 6,7,8 speed DSG transmissions, more advanced technology in the immediate future and just wants to still play around with Accord platforms stuffed with SHAWD and v6s and then compete against Merc and BMW with rwd and v8 which they just can't do now and it is hurting their image. I have not heard any solid information that Honda is working on any rwd platforms or developing any v8s so I don't think they get it that now is the time they need this not 5,10, or 15 years from now. It seems they are afraid to do this or maybe they just don't have the money or are just plain stubborn and are trying to dictate what makes sense for consumers.

The problem is is the TL is a cash cow as it is similiar to an accord and they do not have to engineer a whole new rwd platform for it or the TSX, MDX, etc so it saves them a ton of money and they don't want to change to a new rwd platform if they don't feel they have to because it is going to cost alot. Same with just making v6s based off of Accord 6 cylinders, it costs a bunch of money to engineer new engines for Acura which they do not really want to spend. Unfortunately bean counters run these companies not enthusiasts.

Honda totally blew it with the NSX in that they stopped updating it especially hp wise to compete with the competition and just let it linger and die off, it was such a fantastic car in the 90's but pretty much remained unchanged where the competition grew and improved. Now they have completely and totally have blown it by making the NSX replacement front engined with SHAWD standard making it too heavy and complex and completely out of touch with what the NSX was and abandoning its fanbase. Hell I even read where the new NSX will be based on a another fwd platform modified to be rear biased with SHAWD which is just stupid. Now the new NSX keeps getting pushed back because they have no idea how to do it or design and come out with that hideous concept last year so the prototypes roll around on S2000 bodies because they don't have anything. The only good thing about the new NSX going front engined is that they would finally get a front engined rwd platform that could be shared with other cars but if they try using some kind of front wheel drive, all wheel drive platform that totally kills rwd vehicles from Acura and Acuras future.

As for the GTR and LFA I think the new Honda sports car can fit in nicely between them. Since the next NSX is going to take so long to come out where the GTR is out and the LFA will be in a year or so it gives Honda the chance to know exactly what it has to do to outperform those cars. The LFA is rumored to cost 150K to even over 200K so it is going to be extremely expensive and sell in small numbers. All Honda has to do is come up with something that performs as well or slightly better and price it a good deal less like 90-105K. It will seem like a bargain compared to the overpriced Lexus. The GTR is a Nissan and not on par with a v10 Acura exept maybe performance wise. Hopefully Acura has some common sense and starts putting out rwd vehicles and use the v10 in those vehicles in a few years or else the competition is going to pass them by and they will be known as just selling fancier accord based cars.

aznstuart
Profile for aznstuart
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-14-2008 20:05
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
I think the problem with Honda is that the market right now is moving towards fuel efficient vehicles and greener alternative fuel powertrains.

Look at the current autoshow, most debuts tout its greenness etc. It would look bad for Honda, the greennest company currently, to announce its debut of a new V8 engine. That's what Kia is doing with its Borrego and look, the press is hardly noticing it.

lexusgs
Profile for lexusgs
Re: My thoughts on the RL and the next NSX [View News Item]    (Score: 1, Normal) 01-21-2008 21:00
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
aznstuart wrote:
I think the problem with Honda is that the market right now is moving towards fuel efficient vehicles and greener alternative fuel powertrains.

Look at the current autoshow, most debuts tout its greenness etc. It would look bad for Honda, the greennest company currently, to announce its debut of a new V8 engine. That's what Kia is doing with its Borrego and look, the press is hardly noticing it.



Luxury is not about greenness, responsibility, fuel efficient, etc it is about excess, power, choice, indulgence. Small engined weak green fuel efficient vehicles are not going to cut it in the luxury market. Mercedes and BMW are not fuel efficient with many v8,v10,v12 vehicles and no 4 cylinders yet they are the top selling luxury brands around the world. Honda and Acura are supposed to be different brands, honda for affordable fuel efficient everday vehicles and Acura for expensive powerful luxury vehicles, unfortunately Honda and Acura and way too closely tied which is why Acura is not taken seriously in the luxury market and they can't sell cars over 40K.

Also I would not call Acura vehicles fuel efficient especially when saddled with SHAWD because they have no rwd platforms. The RL, RDX, and MDX all get much poorer gas mileage then its competition. Even Lexus v8s vehicles like the GS and LS get better fuel economy then the v6 RL and MDX. They may have less horsepower and performance but they also have worse gas mileage then the competition, 2 strikes. Toyota is considered greener and sells many more hybrids then Honda, Lexus has hybrids as well as 300+ hp more fuel efficient v6s in rwd platforms and 350+hp v8s in rwd platforms as well as 6 and 8 speed automatic transmissions, no reason Acura can't do this. Selling mid size cars on fwd accord platforms and sub 300hp v6 and 4 cylinders is not luxury. Why they are bothering with a deisel 4 cylinder for Acura is beyond me, when they should be debuting a v8 or at least a turbo 6cylinder. The time for Acura to seperate itself from Honda and finally compete with luxury competition with rwd platforms and v8,v10 and 300+hp 6cylinders, and DSG transmitions is now, if they keep stalling they are going to get passed by all competition and will never be able to sell a car over 40K, even Hyundia is beating them to real luxury with a large v8 rwd sedan.


 
Thread Page - [1]
Contact TOV | Submit Your Article | Submit Your Link | Advertise | TOV Shop | Events | Our Sponsors | TOV Archives
Copyright © 2018 Velocitech Inc. All information contained herein remains the property of Velocitech Inc.
The Temple of VTEC is not affiliated with American Honda Motor Co., Inc. TOV Policies and Guidelines - Credits - Privacy Policy
30 mobile: 0