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TOV Forums > General Talk > > Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!

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Nick GravesX
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Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-21-2018 09:53
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That's quite interesting.

I cannot remember a time when ALFAs weren't crap.

It's a bit too early to tell about the very latest Giulie & Stelvii.

nightflow
Profile for nightflow
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-21-2018 10:02
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Jaguar/Land Rover are still at the bottom of the list. First 90 days of ownership. Surprised Toyota, Lexus and Honda are so low on the list, but this list changes significantly every time so consistency and credibility is low. What stays consistent is the group at the bottom.



Nick GravesX
Profile for Nick GravesX
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-21-2018 11:04
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Do JLR & Volvo still share the same infotech? Might explain that.

The JDP reliability index might be less useless:



LR is of course shite, Jagwah near Acura?

superchg2
Profile for superchg2
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-21-2018 11:12
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JeffX wrote:
CarPhreakD wrote:
Yeah, unlike a lot of you guys (and I'm not really that young, in my 30s now), I have zero memories of Alfa's first attempts in North America. So really, we don't have any brand history to go off of, other than internet memes. I think the bigger problem right now is that amongst millenials, it's still not a really well known brand.

I've been seeing quite a few Stelvios and a few Giulias in my region, but a lot of those are employee lease specials.



So I guess you're too young to remember the Alfa Spider Veloces that were sold here? Those things were notoriously unreliable and from my recollection they seemed to offer terrible build quality and poor overall fit and finish.



Mikeydred
Profile for Mikeydred
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-21-2018 11:25
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JeffX wrote:
CarPhreakD wrote:
Yeah, unlike a lot of you guys (and I'm not really that young, in my 30s now), I have zero memories of Alfa's first attempts in North America. So really, we don't have any brand history to go off of, other than internet memes. I think the bigger problem right now is that amongst millenials, it's still not a really well known brand.

I've been seeing quite a few Stelvios and a few Giulias in my region, but a lot of those are employee lease specials.



So I guess you're too young to remember the Alfa Spider Veloces that were sold here? Those things were notoriously unreliable and from my recollection they seemed to offer terrible build quality and poor overall fit and finish.


I am in my 30s as well, I know Alfa by name but don't remember them in the US. It doesn't help though that testers are failing in the hands of journalists. I do like the Guilia and surprising they are not as expensive as I thought (except for the performance one).

honduh
Profile for honduh
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-21-2018 16:54
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Thank u Nick. I can now justify to the sig. other about getting the Porsche daily driver.
HDNBenjamin
Profile for HDNBenjamin
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-22-2018 00:56
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wow i am shocked at the JD rankings! Acura and Honda needs to and can do better!
owequitit
Profile for owequitit
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-22-2018 01:10
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HDNBenjamin wrote:
wow i am shocked at the JD rankings! Acura and Honda needs to and can do better!


I found an interesting article yesterday that broke down the JD Power study pretty well.

Keep in mind that this particular survey also includes a lot of non-quality related metrics such as ease of use for the electronic features of the car, etc. That said, I mention the article because it said that something like 33% of the issues, on average, were actually quality related and the rest were more design or execution issues.

With that in mind, Acura would be expected to average approximately 10 more quality issues per owner vs Genesis.

HDNBenjamin
Profile for HDNBenjamin
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-22-2018 01:21
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owequitit wrote:
HDNBenjamin wrote:
wow i am shocked at the JD rankings! Acura and Honda needs to and can do better!


I found an interesting article yesterday that broke down the JD Power study pretty well.

Keep in mind that this particular survey also includes a lot of non-quality related metrics such as ease of use for the electronic features of the car, etc. That said, I mention the article because it said that something like 33% of the issues, on average, were actually quality related and the rest were more design or execution issues.

With that in mind, Acura would be expected to average approximately 10 more quality issues per owner vs Genesis.


gotcha! thanks for the insight!

CarPhreakD
Profile for CarPhreakD
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-22-2018 01:35
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JeffX wrote:
CarPhreakD wrote:
Yeah, unlike a lot of you guys (and I'm not really that young, in my 30s now), I have zero memories of Alfa's first attempts in North America. So really, we don't have any brand history to go off of, other than internet memes. I think the bigger problem right now is that amongst millenials, it's still not a really well known brand.

I've been seeing quite a few Stelvios and a few Giulias in my region, but a lot of those are employee lease specials.



So I guess you're too young to remember the Alfa Spider Veloces that were sold here? Those things were notoriously unreliable and from my recollection they seemed to offer terrible build quality and poor overall fit and finish.



Yeah, I was born in the late 80s and by the time I was cogent, I heard zero mentions of Alfa Romeo anywhere. In fact I never saw one until I hit my 20s.

Nick GravesX
Profile for Nick GravesX
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-22-2018 05:54
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HDNBenjamin wrote:
owequitit wrote:
HDNBenjamin wrote:
wow i am shocked at the JD rankings! Acura and Honda needs to and can do better!


I found an interesting article yesterday that broke down the JD Power study pretty well.

Keep in mind that this particular survey also includes a lot of non-quality related metrics such as ease of use for the electronic features of the car, etc. That said, I mention the article because it said that something like 33% of the issues, on average, were actually quality related and the rest were more design or execution issues.

With that in mind, Acura would be expected to average approximately 10 more quality issues per owner vs Genesis.


gotcha! thanks for the insight!



Yeah, you've got to be careful with these indices.

The 90-day one seems to involve a lot of 'touchy-feely' rankings and I therefore treat it as meaningless.

The reliability one is unreliable; it's difficult to judge a bit of trim that drops off, compared to a transmission faliure. And is a jerky shift the same as a seized box...

Surprising perhaps that Lexus has approximately one fault per car, on average. Then again, every car has some sort of recall or another these days. So it's not...

Maybe there is some comfort in knowing a Chrysler or LR is only twice as crap as a posh Toyota!

It really depends how you look on things...

Grace141
Profile for Grace141
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-22-2018 07:38
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Mikeydred wrote:
JeffX wrote:
CarPhreakD wrote:
Yeah, unlike a lot of you guys (and I'm not really that young, in my 30s now), I have zero memories of Alfa's first attempts in North America. So really, we don't have any brand history to go off of, other than internet memes. I think the bigger problem right now is that amongst millenials, it's still not a really well known brand.

I've been seeing quite a few Stelvios and a few Giulias in my region, but a lot of those are employee lease specials.



So I guess you're too young to remember the Alfa Spider Veloces that were sold here? Those things were notoriously unreliable and from my recollection they seemed to offer terrible build quality and poor overall fit and finish.


I am in my 30s as well, I know Alfa by name but don't remember them in the US. It doesn't help though that testers are failing in the hands of journalists. I do like the Guilia and surprising they are not as expensive as I thought (except for the performance one).


This is just my opinion but it was BMW who shoved Alfa out of the US market with the shift in interest from true sports cars to the Baron von Stockbroker sports sedans. BMW was simply the hot car during the late '80s. Alfa fans were aware of the problems with the Alfa cars but they bought them anyway, at least until they found something else more interesting. Like an M6.

The Alfa sedans in the US were mostly invisible until the 75 Milano was launched here. You did see them on the road now and then. I thought the 164 was a wonderful car and it sold well for the first couple of years but even I thought it made its sister Saab 9000 look even better. When I routinely shopped BMWs at my local dealer during the mid-'90s I saw a few trade-in 164s sitting on the back lot. The 5-series of that time was the great sporting sedan Alfa wanted the 164 to be. The 2nd generation M5 just seemed the perfect sports sedan.

https://bringatrailer.com/listing/1991-bmw-m5-38/

It's still fun to look through the auto show Alfa brochures I have from '91 and '92. The thing with the end of the run Spyder of that time was they morphed it into a cousin of the 164 for "brand recognition" or whatever so it looked like a tarted-up senior citizen. Gone was the Graduate duckbill in favor of Lincoln style tail extension. Still cool but not brilliant - sort of a sophisticated Triumph Spitfire for the Alfanut of the '90s. They do sell for good money these days though in spite of the expensive alloy wheels made to look like plastic wheel covers. They're all low mileage cars these days for many reasons.

When Ford relaunched the Thunderbird as a convertible I thought it looked like an octogenarian Alfa Spyder. It's all water under the bridge now. My local BMW dealer evolved from the car guys selling cool cars in the simple dealership building to the lifestyle choice experience center. The local Saab guy supported the brand right up to the point GM pulled his franchise in favor of the national chain at the megaplex dealership. Alfa seems to have a foothold again but it seems to be largely due to the women buying the Stelvios. Acura is as Acura does, sir.

Nick GravesX
Profile for Nick GravesX
Re: Some juicy Acura info!!!    (Score: 1, Normal) 06-22-2018 08:36
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As an aside, the original plan was to convert the 164 to RWD.

But the body-in-white changes were too expensive as Alfa didn't have a pot to piss in. So it ended up being the same FWD layout as its siblings.



 
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