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TOV Forums > Today's Reading Links > > Re: Almost half of all Toyota sales in Europe are hybrids

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KaizenDo
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Almost half of all Toyota sales in Europe are hybrids    (Score: 1, Normal) 04-24-2018 18:39
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Almost half of all Toyota sales in Europe are hybrids

Toyota steigert Hybridauto-Absatz in Europa um 18 Prozent

While german makers are losing sales (mainly due to Diesels=, Toyota is gaining. I said so before - it was a bad decision from Honda to axe it's hybrid models in Europe without any replacements. The issues it had with it's i-DCD system would hardly have been noticed by most european customers, which are used to rough rides from VW or Ford.

BG
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Re: Almost half of all Toyota sales in Europe are hybrids    (Score: 1, Normal) 04-25-2018 07:17
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I passed an imported Fit I-DCD the other day, as you say, the issues weren't really an issue.

https://www.donedeal.ie/cars-for-sale/honda-fit-hybrid-new-model/18197745

Toyota are offering you a Hybrid and if you don't like it you can change to another model, Honda can't compete with that.

Honda don't have enough market share to be able to compete with Toyota in the Hybrid game.

I feel this new CR-V with the i-mmd system will be a game changer though it will not be cheap either.

Lets hope the new Insight will follow and the Urban Ev should garner more sales when it get launched too.

CarPhreakD
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Re: Almost half of all Toyota sales in Europe are hybrids    (Score: 1, Normal) 04-25-2018 15:31
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I mean, the i-DCD system was the subject of 5(?) recalls. It was a pretty serious quality disaster and part of what lead to the previous CEO's exit. It's the exact same kind of shit that you used to mock the Germans for, a poorly developed product that was rushed out to market. Honda's i-MMD system should be far more successful.
KaizenDo
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Re: Almost half of all Toyota sales in Europe are hybrids    (Score: 1, Normal) 04-25-2018 15:44
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Wow, that's awesome! I knew that i-DCD hybrids have alread been exported to some countries, but haven't seen one in Europe yet.

After the Prius and Prius+, Toyota hybridized it's basic lineup in Europe with the Auris and the Yaris. The Auris in it's second generation became available as station wagon, then the RAV4 and the C-HR followed. (Interestingly for Toyota the C-HR is what the 8th Gen Civic Ufo was for Honda. It gains a lot of attention and high sales numbers. Despite that, IMHO the C-HR is ugly and impractical as hell). That's the Toyota EU lineup as it is today.

The Dieselgate scandal and along with it, discussions about strictening emission laws worked as a game changer. People realized they can get highly economic cars without emission issues as from diesel or downsizing models. It also let the paid anti-hybrid propaganda of VW and other german makers crumble - they needed their money elsewhere and had enough trouble of their own.

Looking at Honda, of course right now they don't have anything at all. But if you compare Toyota and Honda in terms of potential lineup, things doesn't look bad at all IMHO
Vitz/Yaris vs Fit/Jazz Honda has the better car.
Auris vs Civic: Toyota has the better car, as Honda has no Civic hybrid.
C-HR vs Vezel/HR-V: Honda has the better vehicle again
RAV4 vs CR-V: I think Honda will have the better vehicle again, as not only th CR-V is more practical than the RAV4, but also the i-MMD can surely be as versatile as Toyotas HSD and is more efficient.

As for the Insight, with it's 4door sedan setup, it won't matter in Europe, as people want hatckbacks. The Urban EV doesn't fit in here at all, since it's an BEV which greatly limits it's potential ownership.

KaizenDo
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Re: Almost half of all Toyota sales in Europe are hybrids    (Score: 1, Normal) 04-25-2018 15:58
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CarPhreakD wrote:
I mean, the i-DCD system was the subject of 5(?) recalls. It was a pretty serious quality disaster and part of what lead to the previous CEO's exit. It's the exact same kind of shit that you used to mock the Germans for, a poorly developed product that was rushed out to market. Honda's i-MMD system should be far more successful.


That's the point I've mentioned about the i-DCD. It caued 5 recalls in Japan and also the decision to hold back from an global launch. Still though, for most european drivers, those DCT issues would hardly ever be noticable or a matter for complaints - as I've mentioned, most of them are used to the shit that VW and Ford puts them up with, and they still buy those brands and trannies.

The i-MMD can become the success story, that the HSD have been for Toyota. Like it's Toyota counterpart, it allows for serial as well als parallel hybrid use. However, in difference to the Toyota system which is fixed in it's combined series-parallel role, the i-MMD is designed to change operation modes in set conditions and thus be more effective. With the introduction of the Insight, Honda showed it could shrink the system from 2.0L engine to 1.5L - enabling it to be used on subcompact cars as the Fit too.

Technical Honda has the better system on hand now. Whether it will be a market success or not will be the matter of Honda Europes marketing strategy. Can they gain the attention of the market, can they make users understand what's special about it and what it makes different from the Toyota system?


 
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