[home][rumors and news][model release matrix][dealer network][desktop calendar][exhaust notes][tov forums][links][search][sponsors][garage][login]

Tire Rack Upgrade Garage
 Search for a Dealer:
 Canadian Flag US Flag
 Honda Acura
 ZIP  
BBC: Honda set to close Swindon factory in 2022
More.......................
Nikkei: Honda enters agreement with CATL for battery supply contract through 2027
More.......................
Acura Marks 30 Years Since Debut of Iconic NSX Supercar
More.......................
American Honda reports January sales
More.......................
Acura Marks 15th Anniversary of Super Handling All-Wheel Drive™
More.......................
Honda releases pricing and EPA information for 2019 Passport
More.......................
American Honda Reports December Sales
More.......................
American Honda Reports November Sales
More.......................
Type R --> Re: DC-R
Join Discussion......
Today's Reading Links --> Re: Swindon in peril
Join Discussion......
General Talk --> Re: Timid AHM marketing
Join Discussion......
Professional Motorsports --> Re: F1 - 2019 Pre-Season Testing - Days 1-4
Join Discussion......
General Talk --> Re: Honda Loses a $38 Million Liability Lawsuit
Join Discussion......
Today's Reading Links --> Re: Poor reliability scores for Honda and Acura
Join Discussion......
TOV Asia --> Re: Honda JP Sales 2018: Hybrids make up 55% of reg. cars
Join Discussion......
General Talk --> Re: Honda's new sub-brand Honda e
Join Discussion......
Amateur Racing & Driving --> Re: My first helmet !
Join Discussion......
Type R --> Re: Honda closing UK plant that builds the Type R
Join Discussion......
General Talk --> Re: Original NSX prototype only had a SOHC V6 without VTEC
Join Discussion......
General Talk --> Re: Rumours that Honda will close its Swindon plant
Join Discussion......
General Talk --> Re: Sunny came home with a mission
Join Discussion......
Professional Motorsports --> Re: 2019 F1 Releases/Launches
Join Discussion......
Type R --> Re: Type R bike carrier
Join Discussion......
2019 Honda Passport PR Photo Gallery
Read Article....................
2019 Acura NSX PR Photo Gallery
Read Article....................
First Drive: 2019 Acura ILX
Read Article....................
2019 Acura ILX PR Photo Gallery
Read Article....................
First Drive: 2019 Honda Pilot
Read Article....................
2019 Honda Pilot PR Photo Gallery
Read Article....................

[fancy] [flat] [simple]
TOV Forums > TSX > > Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl

Go to:

Viewing Threshold (What is this?)

Thread Page - [1]
Author
  Post New Thread
2013TSX
Profile for 2013TSX
How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-04-2013 17:08
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
I just bought a 2013 tsx 2.4 4 cylinder, love the car, handling, perfromance, etc. I couldn't find a 6 cylinder nearby (San Fran), so I went with the 4 banger. Not bad for a 4cy, just missing a little more power. Any good mechanics or ideas to help me increase engine power? I'd be willing to invest a couple grand for an engine upgrade. Any ideas? Or mechanics in the SF Bay area?


notyper
Profile for notyper
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-04-2013 17:32
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
You need a catless downpipe, a cold air intake and an RBC intake manifold from a k20. Combined with a Hondata flashpro and custom tune you should gain about 40 HP. Total cost including install should be about $3k
notyper
Profile for notyper
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-04-2013 17:34
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
You need a catless downpipe, a cold air intake and an RBC intake manifold from a k20. Combined with a Hondata flashpro and custom tune you should gain about 40 HP. Total cost including install should be about $3k

SC

2013TSX
Profile for 2013TSX
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-04-2013 17:47
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
thanks for the info notyper.

do these mods impact standard warranty items on the engine? how about an increase the engine noise or muffler noise?

also, any mechanic recommend i contact for the mods?

xBeastx
Profile for xBeastx
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-04-2013 17:51
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
This graphic explains how to add HP.


2013TSX
Profile for 2013TSX
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-04-2013 18:16
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
funny
notyper
Profile for notyper
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-04-2013 18:41
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
Generally the modifications would only affect the warranty on the parts involved. But if a dealer wanted to get really picky, they could give you grief if you had any serious engine problems. But since you aren't making internal modifications, you really don't have much to worry about.

You will get more intake noise on acceleration (deeper, throatier growl), but exhaust noise should change very little.

You will not pass emissions with the downpipe, meaning come 2019 you'd have to put a catalytic converter back in.

I'm down in SoCal, so I don't know of any good Honda shops in your area.

SC

gilbert
Profile for gilbert
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-08-2013 17:39
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
Shawn, how much would you charge to fly up to NorCal to tune a car? ;)

Gilbert

notyper wrote:

I'm down in SoCal, so I don't know of any good Honda shops in your area.

SC



TonyEX
Profile for TonyEX
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-12-2013 14:53
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
xBeastx wrote:
This graphic explains how to add HP.




The Type R sticker only works if it's OEM. Aftermarket drops the torque.

I should know, we had two OTRs. :-)

Maxtierney
Profile for Maxtierney
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-12-2013 16:52
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
2013TSX wrote:
thanks for the info notyper.

do these mods impact standard warranty items on the engine? how about an increase the engine noise or muffler noise?

also, any mechanic recommend i contact for the mods?



Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act of 1975

Nearly everyone has heard about someone who has taken a vehicle that has been modified with aftermarket parts to a dealer for warranty service, only to have the dealer refuse to cover the defective items. The dealer usually states that because of the aftermarket parts the warranty is void, without even attempting to determine whether the aftermarket part caused the problem.

This is illegal.

Vehicle manufacturers are not allowed to void the vehicle warranty just because aftermarket parts are on the vehicle. To better understand this problem it is best to know the differences between the two types of new car warranties and the two types of emission warranties.

When a vehicle is purchased new and the owner is protected against the faults that may occur by an expressed warranty - an offer by the manufacturer to assume the responsibility for problems with predetermined parts during a stated period of time. Beyond the expressed warranty, the vehicle manufacturer is often held responsible for further implied warranties. These state that a manufactured product should meet certain standards. However, in both cases, the mere presence of aftermarket parts doesn't void the warranty.

There are also two emission warranties (defect and performance) required under the clean air act. The defect warranty requires the manufacturer to produce a vehicle which, at the time of sale, is free of defects that would cause it to not meet the required emission levels for it's useful life as defined in the law. The performance warranty implies a vehicle must maintain certain levels of emission performance over it's useful life. If the vehicle fails to meet the performance warranty requirements, the manufacturer must make repairs at no cost to the owner, even if an aftermarket part is directly responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer cannot void the performance warranty. This protection is the result of a parts self - certification program developed by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA).

In cases where such a failed aftermarket part is responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer must arrange a settlement with the consumer, but by law the new - vehicle warranty is not voided.

Overall, the laws governing warranties are very clear. The only time a new vehicle warranty can be voided is if an aftermarket part has been installed and it can be proven that it is responsible for an emission warranty claim. However, a vehicle manufacturer or dealership cannot void a warranty simply because an an aftermarket equipment has been installed on a vehicle.

If a dealership denies a warranty claim and you think the claim falls under the rules explained above concerning the clean air act (such as an emission part failure), obtain a written explanation of the dealers refusal. Then follow the steps outlined in the owners manual. However, if this fails, then phone your complaint in to the EPA at (202) 233-9040 or (202) 326-9100.

If a dealer denies a warranty claim involving an implied or expressed new car warranty and you would like help, you can contact the Federal Trade Commission (FTC). The FTC works for the consumer to prevent fraudulent, deceptive and unfair business practices in the marketplace and to provide information to help consumers spot, stop and avoid them. To file a complaint, you can call toll-free, 1-877-FTC-HELP (1-877-382-4357), or use the online complaint form. The FTC enters Internet, telemarketing, and other fraud-related complaints into Consumer Sentinel, a secure, online database available to hundreds of civil and criminal law enforcement agencies worldwide


TonyEX
Profile for TonyEX
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-13-2013 13:00
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
Maxtierney wrote:


There are also two emission warranties (defect and performance) required under the clean air act. The defect warranty requires the manufacturer to produce a vehicle which, at the time of sale, is free of defects that would cause it to not meet the required emission levels for it's useful life as defined in the law. The performance warranty implies a vehicle must maintain certain levels of emission performance over it's useful life. If the vehicle fails to meet the performance warranty requirements, the manufacturer must make repairs at no cost to the owner, even if an aftermarket part is directly responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer cannot void the performance warranty. This protection is the result of a parts self - certification program developed by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA).

In cases where such a failed aftermarket part is responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer must arrange a settlement with the consumer, but by law the new - vehicle warranty is not voided.

Overall, the laws governing warranties are very clear. The only time a new vehicle warranty can be voided is if an aftermarket part has been installed and it can be proven that it is responsible for an emission warranty claim. However, a vehicle manufacturer or dealership cannot void a warranty simply because an an aftermarket equipment has been installed on a vehicle.

...



So, let's say you remove the catalytic converter and put in a straight pipe.... By pure inspection the dealer can deny the claim that you failed to pass emissions....

However, and more to the point, what if the electronics controlling the powertrain started to misbehave due to out of tolerance values caused by the aftermarket modifications and operated the powertrain in a manner that caused a failure down the line?

It's just not that simple.

I'd think that anyone using aftermarket parts needs to properly think about this and know his/her dealer very well, use a well known -and respected- installer and use well known -and accepted- aftermarket parts.

With all due respect to Shawn, my philosophy is to buy the power I need/want when I get the car. If I want TL power in a TSX then I'm wrong... I might as well buy the TL to being with and live with it.

During the warranty period, of course...

Suspension and tires, of course, are a different story.



Maxtierney
Profile for Maxtierney
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-13-2013 14:13
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
TonyEX wrote:
Maxtierney wrote:


There are also two emission warranties (defect and performance) required under the clean air act. The defect warranty requires the manufacturer to produce a vehicle which, at the time of sale, is free of defects that would cause it to not meet the required emission levels for it's useful life as defined in the law. The performance warranty implies a vehicle must maintain certain levels of emission performance over it's useful life. If the vehicle fails to meet the performance warranty requirements, the manufacturer must make repairs at no cost to the owner, even if an aftermarket part is directly responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer cannot void the performance warranty. This protection is the result of a parts self - certification program developed by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA).

In cases where such a failed aftermarket part is responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer must arrange a settlement with the consumer, but by law the new - vehicle warranty is not voided.

Overall, the laws governing warranties are very clear. The only time a new vehicle warranty can be voided is if an aftermarket part has been installed and it can be proven that it is responsible for an emission warranty claim. However, a vehicle manufacturer or dealership cannot void a warranty simply because an an aftermarket equipment has been installed on a vehicle.

...



So, let's say you remove the catalytic converter and put in a straight pipe.... By pure inspection the dealer can deny the claim that you failed to pass emissions....

However, and more to the point, what if the electronics controlling the powertrain started to misbehave due to out of tolerance values caused by the aftermarket modifications and operated the powertrain in a manner that caused a failure down the line?

It's just not that simple.

I'd think that anyone using aftermarket parts needs to properly think about this and know his/her dealer very well, use a well known -and respected- installer and use well known -and accepted- aftermarket parts.

With all due respect to Shawn, my philosophy is to buy the power I need/want when I get the car. If I want TL power in a TSX then I'm wrong... I might as well buy the TL to being with and live with it.

During the warranty period, of course...

Suspension and tires, of course, are a different story.





The point I was trying to make is that a dealer cannot void your warranty due to modifications made with aftermarket parts. I am a tuner, and do all of my own work. I have removed the entire exhaust system from header to muffler tip, but I still take my car in for service. The dealer and I understand that my car will never pass emmisions in California, in its current state. This does not void my warranty, nor would I ever make a claim regarding smog.

Moreover, most external modifications (i.e. I/H/E) will not cause the car's computer to "misbehave". It will adjust to the new operating critria. In most cases, even some internals/externals can be changed without causing computer errrors. Stage 1 Cams, lightened flywheels, pulleys - for example. All on my Honda, and still under warranty. Beyond that, a reflash or a standalone computer would be neeeded.

You can never have enough power, but most people are limited by funds. I'd love to have the option to buy TL, but I am limited to a Civic budget.

No one goes actually to a dealer for advice on aftermarket parts, unless they are willing to pay mark-up and/or are okay with limited gains/resources. Most "quaility" parts are not supported by the dealer-sourced.

TonyEX
Profile for TonyEX
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-13-2013 17:34
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
Maxtierney wrote:
TonyEX wrote:
Maxtierney wrote:


There are also two emission warranties (defect and performance) required under the clean air act. The defect warranty requires the manufacturer to produce a vehicle which, at the time of sale, is free of defects that would cause it to not meet the required emission levels for it's useful life as defined in the law. The performance warranty implies a vehicle must maintain certain levels of emission performance over it's useful life. If the vehicle fails to meet the performance warranty requirements, the manufacturer must make repairs at no cost to the owner, even if an aftermarket part is directly responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer cannot void the performance warranty. This protection is the result of a parts self - certification program developed by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA).

In cases where such a failed aftermarket part is responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer must arrange a settlement with the consumer, but by law the new - vehicle warranty is not voided.

Overall, the laws governing warranties are very clear. The only time a new vehicle warranty can be voided is if an aftermarket part has been installed and it can be proven that it is responsible for an emission warranty claim. However, a vehicle manufacturer or dealership cannot void a warranty simply because an an aftermarket equipment has been installed on a vehicle.

...



So, let's say you remove the catalytic converter and put in a straight pipe.... By pure inspection the dealer can deny the claim that you failed to pass emissions....

However, and more to the point, what if the electronics controlling the powertrain started to misbehave due to out of tolerance values caused by the aftermarket modifications and operated the powertrain in a manner that caused a failure down the line?

It's just not that simple.

I'd think that anyone using aftermarket parts needs to properly think about this and know his/her dealer very well, use a well known -and respected- installer and use well known -and accepted- aftermarket parts.

With all due respect to Shawn, my philosophy is to buy the power I need/want when I get the car. If I want TL power in a TSX then I'm wrong... I might as well buy the TL to being with and live with it.

During the warranty period, of course...

Suspension and tires, of course, are a different story.





The point I was trying to make is that a dealer cannot void your warranty due to modifications made with aftermarket parts. I am a tuner, and do all of my own work. I have removed the entire exhaust system from header to muffler tip, but I still take my car in for service. The dealer and I understand that my car will never pass emmisions in California, in its current state. This does not void my warranty, nor would I ever make a claim regarding smog.

Moreover, most external modifications (i.e. I/H/E) will not cause the car's computer to "misbehave". It will adjust to the new operating critria. In most cases, even some internals/externals can be changed without causing computer errrors. Stage 1 Cams, lightened flywheels, pulleys - for example. All on my Honda, and still under warranty. Beyond that, a reflash or a standalone computer would be neeeded.

You can never have enough power, but most people are limited by funds. I'd love to have the option to buy TL, but I am limited to a Civic budget.

No one goes actually to a dealer for advice on aftermarket parts, unless they are willing to pay mark-up and/or are okay with limited gains/resources. Most "quaility" parts are not supported by the dealer-sourced.




If you read carefully to what you wrote: you quoted the Clean Air Act, which means that you are writing about the emission warranties on your car to pass smog.

If you modify your car with NON CARB approved parts then the manufacturer's PERFORMANCE warranty per the Clean Air Act is void, huh? The manufacturer will state that the car passed the DEFECT warranty because it worked when it was delivered to you, by when you changed the design with a non approved part then they no longer are responsible.

Furthermore, even if you used a CARB approved part, they might then state that the OTHER manufacturer is partly or wholly responsible and then you get into a finger pointing situation.

But we agree on this, so this is not an issue of contention.

Now, as to the other warranties. the ones that relate to the car's performance proper, non withstanding the smog warranties, as I wrote, if you modify your car you better be in good cahoots with your dealer.

And I write this from the point of view of an individual owner doing the work... a professional tuner would likely have a working relationship ( ie: reputation and credence ) with the dealer.

This has nothing to do with how good you are nor how good the parts are but with the perception that the dealer has of your car. And, most unfortunately IMHO, perception is reality.

Now, I figure that if I went to Shawn's shop and had him make some changes to my cars the service writers at Scott Robinson would have no issue on the warranty because Shawn Church is a known factor (*) and likely to use good parts from known dealers like Oscar at Jackson Racing.

And, they've known us for like 20++ years so they know we don't do cheap stunts and we keep all the paperwork.

In your case, it sounds like you are in the business as a professional and the dealer trusts you, so then you too are in the clear ( as I noted earlier ).

But, otherwise, as an individual owner you have to be extremely careful. If you show up, and they don't know you very well and on opening the hood they see a lot of residential garage engineering then they likely won't bother to spend anytime figuring out what you did because they stand to lose money on those hours.. so they're most likely to write you off and then it will be up to YOU to prove otherwise.

And guess what, the Gov. is likely to back them up because those nannys would rather seal the whole hood under lock and key and keep you from messing around with it.

So it comes down that on a warranty, if an individual owner starts messing with the car, it will likely become a thorn of contention for him to prove that it was not he who broke the car.

...

Yep, I just met a coworker who races an old Civic and drives an upgraded Integra that was modified by Church Automotive.



gofast182
Profile for gofast182
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-14-2013 16:30
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
TonyEX wrote:
Maxtierney wrote:


There are also two emission warranties (defect and performance) required under the clean air act. The defect warranty requires the manufacturer to produce a vehicle which, at the time of sale, is free of defects that would cause it to not meet the required emission levels for it's useful life as defined in the law. The performance warranty implies a vehicle must maintain certain levels of emission performance over it's useful life. If the vehicle fails to meet the performance warranty requirements, the manufacturer must make repairs at no cost to the owner, even if an aftermarket part is directly responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer cannot void the performance warranty. This protection is the result of a parts self - certification program developed by the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and the Specialty Equipment Market Association (SEMA).

In cases where such a failed aftermarket part is responsible for a warranty claim, the vehicle manufacturer must arrange a settlement with the consumer, but by law the new - vehicle warranty is not voided.

Overall, the laws governing warranties are very clear. The only time a new vehicle warranty can be voided is if an aftermarket part has been installed and it can be proven that it is responsible for an emission warranty claim. However, a vehicle manufacturer or dealership cannot void a warranty simply because an an aftermarket equipment has been installed on a vehicle.

...




With all due respect to Shawn, my philosophy is to buy the power I need/want when I get the car. If I want TL power in a TSX then I'm wrong... I might as well buy the TL to being with and live with it.




I agree with this (not to say what Shawn suggested can't be done well and be reliable).

wooderson79
Profile for wooderson79
Re: How to add more Hp in 2013 TSX 4cyl    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-14-2013 19:39
Reply to This Message Attach Quote to Reply
What about the CT Engineering Kit - is there a timeline on the supercharger?

 
Thread Page - [1]
Go to:
Contact TOV | Submit Your Article | Submit Your Link | Advertise | TOV Shop | Events | Our Sponsors | TOV Archives
Copyright © 2018 Velocitech Inc. All information contained herein remains the property of Velocitech Inc.
The Temple of VTEC is not affiliated with American Honda Motor Co., Inc. TOV Policies and Guidelines - Credits - Privacy Policy
30 mobile: 0