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A little Prelude tidbit that came from last week's dealer meeting...
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Acura releases details on upcoming 2025 MDX refresh
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Acura confirms debut of long-rumored entry-premium CUV for early 2025
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American Honda reports March and 1st Quarter 2024 sales results
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Spied on the Street! 2025 Acura MDX Type S
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Honda releases details on upcoming 2025 Fuel-Cell Plug-in CR-V
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Honda enables Wireless CarPlay and Android Auto on 10th generation Accords via software upgrade
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American Honda reports January 2024 sales results
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General Talk --> Re: The Old Man's thoughts about Honda's future
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Professional Motorsports --> Re: Alonso Re-signs with Aston Martin and Honda
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General Talk --> Re: Tesla Sales Fall
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Prelude --> Re: New PRELUDE at Long Beach GP
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Videos --> Re: Firestarter
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ZDX --> Re: 2nd Generation ZDX Reviews
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General Talk --> Re: Elon Musk's boondoggle
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Fuel Cell Technology --> Re: Bye Bye.
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Honda Motorcycles --> Re: I want an SL125 or better
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Professional Motorsports --> Re: INDYCAR: 2 Penske Chevy cars DQed from St. Pete Standings
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Professional Motorsports --> Re: BBC: Newey Leaving Red Bull
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General Talk --> Re: Next gen Honda engines, say hello to serial hybrids.
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Passport --> Re: 2025 Passport
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Civic --> Re: 2025 Civic Tidbits....RIP 1.5t
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The Type-S

Type S - Formula for Success?
Though the TL has been quite a sales success, the success has come in the face of unyielding criticism from a number of scribes from enthusiast magazines. The flare point of all this criticism is the TL's front drive architecture, which is faulted for a variety of transgressions, with the two primary fouls being "torque steer" and a general corruption in feel as the car approaches its (rather high) limits. While we're counting the days until Acura quenches our thirst for a true FR (front engined, rear wheel drive) sport sedan, the criticism hasn't been entirely deserved. Sure, the TL may not feel quite as polished at the limits as the BMW 3-series, but there's no question that the TL has been very competitive in its class in terms of overall performance - it's always had far more performance than is really necessary for street use. When rumors surfaced that a 3.5L TL Type-S would be introduced for the 2007 model year, there were numerous angst-ridden forum discussions regarding the wisdom of attempting to deliver even more power and torque through the TL's front wheels. After driving both 5AT and 6MT versions of the 2007 TL Type-S, we can assure you that Acura's engineers have done a commendable job of doing just that.

Acura's pretty much locked into the FF layout for this generation of TL's, so there's little point in beating a dead horse at this point. While the entry premium FR sedan marketplace has expanded since the 3rd generation TL's introduction, Acura's decision was pretty much set in stone long ago, so for 2007 they had to make the best of the situation and focus on evolving and improving the TL to the best of their abilities. To that end, the Type-S has been endowed with even more thrust and a sportier suspension.

Borrowing Big Bro's Motor
While the TL's drivetrain configuration hasn't handicapped sales, it didn't take long for the third generation TL's initial horsepower leadership position to erode. Infiniti was first to respond with a 280hp/298hp (AT/MT) update to their G35, followed by Lexus with their IS350, which (thanks to its sophisticated 306hp 3.5L DOHC Direct Injection V6 and 6-speed AT) boasts of rather astonishing straightline performance. Entering the 2007 model year, BMW, Lexus, and Infiniti all currently offer competing products with 300hp (or more), so Acura had to act quickly so as not to be left in the dust.

Fortunately for the engineering team, they didn't have to look far to stay in the hunt. As most of our readers already know, the 2005 Acura RL launched with a 3.5L SOHC V6 that was rated at 300hp (later revised on paper to 290hp due to the recent SAE standards revisions). Since this motor is essentially a stroked version of the TL's 3.2, it was a natural choice for the TL Type S. Under the hood of the TL, this new motor brings the output totals up to 286hp@6200 rpms (+28hp) and 256lb-ft@5000 rpms (+23 lb-ft). The great news is that this added thrust is generated by a motor that weighs about 15lbs less than last year's 3.2L motor. Acura attributes the weight savings to the use of hollow camshafts, a plastic oil strainer (instead of steel), and the use of magnesium for the cylinder head covers and intake manifold. Additionally, while the new motor has gone from an oversquare design (89x86mm bore/stroke) to an undersquare design (89x94mm bore/stroke), nothing in the way of smoothness or revs have been sacrificed with the redline remaining at 6800 rpms. While the 3.5 pulls strongly, quietly, and smoothly in the RL, the ferocity level has been dialed up several notches in the lighter TL chassis, but the motor remains very well mannered.

More Beef in the 'Mission
In order to reliably deliver this additional twist to the pavement, Acura had to spec brawnier transmissions. The TL's new 5AT 'mission is a four-shaft design that's based upon (you guessed it) the RL's tranny, though according to engineers it has been beefed up slightly since it has to deliver 100% of its maximum torque to only two wheels instead of distributing it through all four contact patches. The 6-speed manual transmission is a beefed up version of the '04-'06 6MT with higher strength gears, increased bearing capacity and a new carbon synchro applied on the reverse gear. Revisions to the shifter have reduced the shifter operating load by a claimed 20%. Shifter feel is indeed light and smooth, approaching the feel of the TSX's superslick gearbox.

One of the biggest improvements to the 6MT drivetrain is the clutch take-up. I can't tell you how many times we stalled the '04 TL 6MT during our 2004 winter road test where three TOV editors rotated between 3 different 6MT Honda products over several thousand miles of driving. Every time we swapped vehicles, the TL was inevitably stalled almost immediately. The problem was the TL's nanometer clutch take-up. To address this problem, Acura engineers revised the geometry within the clutch mechanism and have changed the characteristics of the friction disk so the clutch take-up now takes place over a longer duration of the pedal's stroke. It now feels more natural and consistent with other Honda and Acura products. Indeed, during this first encounter I managed to drive the TL Type-S 6MT without once stalling it.

On the 5AT side, Acura has added steering wheel mounted paddle shifters and new logic to the transmission which electronically blips the throttle to smooth downshifts and contribute to the "raciness" of the Type-S badge. The rev-matching downshift effect is largely transparent until you call for a downshift near the top of 1st or 2nd gear's operating ranges. It's most fun and "F1-like" when you're kicking down to first at around 30mph or so - the engine revs jump very quickly, releasing a bark of the exhaust that tingles the hairs on the back of your neck. You may find your inner child encouraging you to call for frequent and unnecessary downshifts. Otherwise, I'm a bit of a spoilsport when it comes to "paddle shifters", though - so far none that I've tried have kept me from wishing I was driving a manual transmission instead. At least with the Type-S, Acura didn't make the mistake of eliminating the secondary gate on the console shifter - with the Type-S you get your choice of either, because most paddle shifter implementations are useless as soon as the road gets twisty.

Now, You Call the Shots
Mechanically, Acura now has sufficient confidence in the integrity of the new transmission that the 5AT's logic has been programmed to allow the driver to downshift into 1st gear as well as allowing the driver to fully control the 1-2 upshift point (previously the 5AT wouldn't allow forced downshifts into first, and it would automatically upshift from 1st-2nd just short of the redline, regardless of the driver's input). Additionally, Acura has raised the limit on (closed throttle) downshift speeds on both '07 TL models, permitting you to shift down into a lower gear sooner than the 2006 and earlier editions, with the TL Type-S having the most aggressive mapping and a claimed 26% improvement in downshift response time (Acura shows approximately half that level of improvement for the base '07 TL). This new freedom is appreciated, but for those times when you are denied a request for a downshift because you're 100rpm outside the acceptable range, it would be nice if the Type-S' transmission would "remember" any downshift requests for maybe five seconds or so and then kick down to the preselected gear as soon as the vehicle speed has slowed sufficiently. This would make it much easier to preselect a gear during heavy braking into a corner. For the record, Acura's 5AT still needs to shift down through the range sequentially - e.g. you can't quickly skip from 5th directly to 3rd without going through 4th. This is how some of the newer German automatic transmissions work. Generally the 5AT transmissions work pretty well, executing upshifts and downshifts with efficiency and precision. Most importantly, the TL never feels like the 5AT is robbing it of much performance, particularly in the Type-S model.



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Date Thread Starter Thread
11-22-2006 21:06 Just got mine! Initial impressions...   (Score: 1, Normal) RW66
11-24-2006 15:16 notyper
12-02-2006 16:06 RW66
12-06-2006 17:00 6SPDTL
12-06-2006 21:05 RW66
08-15-2007 18:50 TLSAUTO
01-04-2007 15:22 Tosa1962
11-08-2006 14:01 Why bother releasing TL-TypeS? Go G35   (Score: 1, Normal) Honda-D
11-08-2006 14:42 shingles
11-09-2006 01:37 Honda-D
11-09-2006 04:15 Wizard
11-10-2006 02:52 Powered by Honda
11-10-2006 07:35 99SI
11-10-2006 09:55 vtecTL1
11-10-2006 11:21 notyper
11-10-2006 12:32 MARCVTEC2000
11-10-2006 22:09 blu
11-10-2006 17:37 ephemere
11-11-2006 00:03 AcuraSM
11-11-2006 00:52 ephemere
11-11-2006 15:11 AcuraSM
11-11-2006 15:37 AcuraSM
11-11-2006 20:38 ephemere
11-12-2006 00:14 Honda-D
11-13-2006 09:41 esboi84
11-15-2006 12:52 Powered by Honda
11-10-2006 22:11 Powered by Honda
11-10-2006 22:27 Powered by Honda
11-10-2006 23:04 ephemere
11-14-2006 14:14 Powered by Honda
11-10-2006 14:52 shingles
11-08-2006 14:44 Wizard
11-08-2006 15:40 Phil17
11-08-2006 18:22 RyanDL
11-08-2006 23:18 dydx
11-08-2006 23:52 outersquare
11-09-2006 10:52 alva
11-09-2006 13:16 Honda-D
11-09-2006 22:46 Mike Freitas
11-10-2006 02:39 Powered by Honda
11-11-2006 06:18 osaze
11-11-2006 10:56 ephemere
11-11-2006 18:46 Wizard
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11-12-2006 19:31 Wizard
11-11-2006 12:38 TwoDogs
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11-27-2006 20:36 Oacosta27
01-17-2007 23:52
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Mugenkoo
12-06-2006 21:13 Has anyone seen any "official" 0-60 times?   (Score: 1, Normal) RW66
01-04-2007 15:00 Tosa1962
11-26-2006 09:15 ...I could not agree MORE@   (Score: 1, Normal) ezshift5
11-06-2006 14:06 Drove 2007 TL-S Saturday   (Score: 1, Normal) jgalvan1
11-08-2006 21:12 3.0ivtec
11-15-2006 22:02 BostonAndy
11-16-2006 02:11 Powered by Honda
11-16-2006 18:05 Pseudomaniac
11-16-2006 21:20 Powered by Honda
11-16-2006 22:34 Honda-D
11-16-2006 23:13 jgalvan1
11-17-2006 12:59 vtecTL1
11-17-2006 14:17 jgalvan1
11-19-2006 09:49 Pseudomaniac
11-12-2006 10:37 Too Much $ - Not Enough HP   (Score: 1, Normal) Pseudomaniac
11-13-2006 21:46 Powered by Honda
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11-16-2006 09:35 RyanDL
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11-15-2006 20:48 jgalvan1
11-15-2006 21:56 Jcc35
11-13-2006 22:23 Has Honda fall into model cycle hell?   (Score: 1, Normal) Honda-D
11-13-2006 23:16 jgalvan1
11-14-2006 06:26 Newumbrella
11-14-2006 14:30 jgalvan1
11-15-2006 07:44 99SI
11-14-2006 21:01 shingles
11-15-2006 14:24 Honda-D
11-15-2006 16:04 Wizard
11-15-2006 20:32 jgalvan1
11-15-2006 17:43 Thanks Jeff!   (Score: 1, Normal) 94sir
11-07-2006 15:53 What about a manual on the RL?   (Score: 1, Normal) 6SPDTL
11-07-2006 16:48 CivicB18
11-08-2006 11:25 Wizard
11-08-2006 12:27 siegen
11-08-2006 12:51 Wizard
11-10-2006 17:51 hondacura
11-15-2006 13:07 siegen
11-15-2006 17:40 accord1989
11-08-2006 13:14 JeffX
11-15-2006 14:18 Has any car mag tested the TL Type-S yet?   (Score: 1, Normal) dirk311
11-06-2006 15:45 Getting Pricey   (Score: 1, Normal) 99SI
11-06-2006 16:38 jgalvan1
11-08-2006 11:24 jero
11-08-2006 13:24 ephemere
11-08-2006 13:46 JeffX
11-08-2006 14:06 ephemere
11-08-2006 14:46 JeffX
11-08-2006 14:08 Honda-D
11-08-2006 14:19 ephemere
11-08-2006 14:43 Wizard
11-09-2006 19:20 jgalvan1
11-09-2006 20:27 ephemere
11-10-2006 02:44 Powered by Honda
11-12-2006 00:19 Honda-D
11-12-2006 11:18 notyper
11-12-2006 13:37 ephemere
11-13-2006 11:03 esboi84
11-13-2006 13:43 outersquare
11-14-2006 06:32 Newumbrella
11-13-2006 12:07 HONDA NEEDS a RESET Button   (Score: 1, Normal) techline
11-13-2006 12:53 notyper
11-06-2006 10:10 Which wheels are ugly??   (Score: 1, Normal) Deak69
11-06-2006 11:39 RAdams
11-06-2006 12:02 JeffX
11-06-2006 17:53 Deak69
11-06-2006 18:54 HJV1
11-06-2006 19:48 99SI
11-06-2006 20:40 Deak69
11-07-2006 13:37 Mattman
11-07-2006 22:59 Nerdsrock22
11-07-2006 23:39 onefasthuman
11-11-2006 23:06 Tony Hondana
11-07-2006 18:44 Larger Grille? Wider Sills?   (Score: 1, Normal) VinceThe1
11-08-2006 23:14 dydx
11-08-2006 22:01 Sales vs 02/03 Type-S   (Score: 1, Normal) 99SI
11-06-2006 20:41 1 sec off 0-60 and 1/4 mile   (Score: 1, Normal) 96civicEX
11-08-2006 11:21 Wizard
11-06-2006 21:15 Any more pics of the Vivid Blue Type S?   (Score: 1, Normal) nowakj66
11-07-2006 06:35 jlin583
11-07-2006 12:25 Tuan
11-07-2006 17:32 nowakj66
11-07-2006 12:42 vroom, Vrooom, VROOOOOMMMM!   (Score: 1, Normal) TonyEX
11-07-2006 08:32 Appreciate the review   (Score: 1, Normal) iksenna
11-06-2006 10:05 Excellent Review "Again"   (Score: 1, Normal) Mike Freitas
11-06-2006 11:53 key123
11-06-2006 14:00 cat in the baby
11-06-2006 14:24 jgalvan1
11-06-2006 19:25 nowakj66
11-06-2006 18:14 Exterior styling!   (Score: 1, Normal) CivicB18
Jump to:
First Drive: 2023 Acura Integra - Rebirth of an Icon?
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2023 Acura Integra PR Photo Gallery
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2022 Acura MDX Specs and Features
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Photo Gallery: 2021 Acura TLX Advance
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Photo Gallery: 2021 Acura TLX A-Spec
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