The Fiesta S2000 comes with a naturally aspirated 1998cc I4 Duratec S2000 engine good for 280 horsepower and 192 lb-ft of twisting torque all the while spinning to an 8,000 rpm redline. That mill gets mated to a permanent all-wheel drive system hooked up to a sequential manual transmission with an AP clutch. Sizable Brembos are at all four corners (and like the wheels, vary in size depending on asphalt or gravel). Ready for the best part? It weighs just 2,640 pounds – and that's with the roll cage.
Any idea how they did this? A few ideas I had were race gas, a less restrictive and street illegal exhaust system and maybe the relative disregard for fuel mileage and reliability, but would it allow that much power out of an otherwise ordinary naturally aspirated 2.0L 4 cylinder? I guess what I'm essentially asking is, is this a feat that anyone could accomplish given the lack of restrictions, or is this something special?
Given the lack of restrictions, a 3.0 liter N/A Formula Engine can produce over 900hp. 280hp from a 2.0 liter is not that hard to imagine, though i don't know what tricks they used.
I'm imagining this powertrain under the chassis of my S2000...
Anyway it's certainly impressive whenever anyone gets that kind of specific output but it's not beyond comprehension. You can approach that power out of an F20 or F22 with ITBs, header, exhaust, and a good tune.
The Fiesta S2000 comes with a naturally aspirated 1998cc I4 Duratec S2000 engine good for 280 horsepower and 192 lb-ft of twisting torque all the while spinning to an 8,000 rpm redline. That mill gets mated to a permanent all-wheel drive system hooked up to a sequential manual transmission with an AP clutch. Sizable Brembos are at all four corners (and like the wheels, vary in size depending on asphalt or gravel). Ready for the best part? It weighs just 2,640 pounds – and that's with the roll cage.
Any idea how they did this? A few ideas I had were race gas, a less restrictive and street illegal exhaust system and maybe the relative disregard for fuel mileage and reliability, but would it allow that much power out of an otherwise ordinary naturally aspirated 2.0L 4 cylinder? I guess what I'm essentially asking is, is this a feat that anyone could accomplish given the lack of restrictions, or is this something special?
It's something anyone can achieve for that kind of racecars. That's the kind of power any WTCC NA car achieves...
It's something anyone can achieve for that kind of racecars. That's the kind of power any WTCC NA car achieves...
and it's been like that since the 90's. Aggressive cam and valves, high compression...
But with these specs? N/A 4 cyl revving to only 8k making 140hp/L?
I admit I don't know much about the series, but I thought most of the engines in it were turbocharged/of a larger displacement and/or cylinder count. That at least seems to be the way it is with most other races that involve AWD. If that isn't true though, why don't people make a big deal about the series? I mean, a lot of us here like high revving naturally aspirated engines, right? Though, the sound this particular car makes is a little too... insect-like.
It's something anyone can achieve for that kind of racecars. That's the kind of power any WTCC NA car achieves...
and it's been like that since the 90's. Aggressive cam and valves, high compression...
In the 1990s Neil Brown Engineering in England achieved a claimed 325bhp, 206lbs/ft for the BTTC Super Touring Accord engine, which was rev limited to 8500rpm. It was based on a sleeved down Prelude block, and ran without Vtec.
My race B18c sleeved to 2 litres, running 13:1 compression ratio, Toda Killer Vtec cams and reving to 9000 was good for around 270bhp, sucking through a standard Type R intake manifold.
Yeah, 280 hp from a 2 liter these days is child's play. Literally. Any kid with a wrench who can read a factory shop manual can build a K20 that makes that sort of power on 91 octane piss water. You leave alone the block and head casting. You change out valvesprings, retainers and cams. Add a good header and exhaust, along with a cold air intake and tune it. With the right cams you're going to pick up 70 hp over stock. And if you run the right high flow cat (most people don't, its easier to run a test pipe and put the cat on for emissions), you can make it clean.
If you want to spend more money and build the internals, up the compression and run ITBs, you're looking at 325-330 hp on a reliable (read, made for more than just 1/4 mile passes) engine that only needs 100 octane or so to be happy.
Hell, our old S2000 engine, which had to run all factory parts (including throttle body and intake manifold) save the intake and header/exhaust was making close to that power level (about 30-40 hp better than stock) with just blueprinting and tuning (and a really good Hytech header/exhaust setup). Our 2.2 was a good 10% beyond that under the same rules.
So, in summary, nothing special. Nothing to be critical of, but not even close to ground breaking or top of class.
With the displacement and RPM already known, I don't see how this is possible without increasing the compression ratio by a large amount. That will require the structural members to be awfully strong. Puzzled....
notyper wrote: Yeah, 280 hp from a 2 liter these days is child's play. Literally. Any kid with a wrench who can read a factory shop manual can build a K20 that makes that sort of power on 91 octane piss water. You leave alone the block and head casting. You change out valvesprings, retainers and cams. Add a good header and exhaust, along with a cold air intake and tune it. With the right cams you're going to pick up 70 hp over stock. And if you run the right high flow cat (most people don't, its easier to run a test pipe and put the cat on for emissions), you can make it clean.
If you want to spend more money and build the internals, up the compression and run ITBs, you're looking at 325-330 hp on a reliable (read, made for more than just 1/4 mile passes) engine that only needs 100 octane or so to be happy.
Hell, our old S2000 engine, which had to run all factory parts (including throttle body and intake manifold) save the intake and header/exhaust was making close to that power level (about 30-40 hp better than stock) with just blueprinting and tuning (and a really good Hytech header/exhaust setup). Our 2.2 was a good 10% beyond that under the same rules.
So, in summary, nothing special. Nothing to be critical of, but not even close to ground breaking or top of class.
SC
Thanks for the response. Looks like I'm missing out on a lot of power with my stock Si. Might have to change that.
Airflow baby, airflow. You're only increasing the torque by 10%-12% on the K20s, which can be done solely with efficiency and flow improvements (and good tuning). But you're making it breath much better at high rpms with intake/exhaust flow changes, and especially with bigger cams. 180 lbs-ft at 8000 rpm is 270 hp.
notyper wrote: Yeah, 280 hp from a 2 liter these days is child's play. Literally. Any kid with a wrench who can read a factory shop manual can build a K20 that makes that sort of power on 91 octane piss water. You leave alone the block and head casting. You change out valvesprings, retainers and cams. Add a good header and exhaust, along with a cold air intake and tune it. With the right cams you're going to pick up 70 hp over stock. And if you run the right high flow cat (most people don't, its easier to run a test pipe and put the cat on for emissions), you can make it clean.
If you want to spend more money and build the internals, up the compression and run ITBs, you're looking at 325-330 hp on a reliable (read, made for more than just 1/4 mile passes) engine that only needs 100 octane or so to be happy.
Hell, our old S2000 engine, which had to run all factory parts (including throttle body and intake manifold) save the intake and header/exhaust was making close to that power level (about 30-40 hp better than stock) with just blueprinting and tuning (and a really good Hytech header/exhaust setup). Our 2.2 was a good 10% beyond that under the same rules.
So, in summary, nothing special. Nothing to be critical of, but not even close to ground breaking or top of class.
SC
How difficult would it be to tune an S2000 for 40 more hp at 1000 RPM's lower? I think the K20 is the more comparable engine (assuming you don't increase the redline). I mean, 140hp/L on 91 octane and the same redline as a Civic Si (40% power improvement, pretty large torque improvement) is pretty good. But then again, it IS a race-car..
The stock S2000 peaks at 8300 rpm. Keeping all stock internals/cams will do nothing to change that.
Modified, but stock block/head K20's also tend to peak around 8000 rpm. And all this is with crappy 91 octane gas.
Believe me, we have race built K20's putting down well over 310 hp to the _hubs_ (or about 340 crank), with 99% of peak power from 7800 to 9200 rpm. Remember, while the F20C is built stouter than the K20, their heads are virtually identical in flow and the K20 has a major advantage with i-VTEC.
Hell, one of my employees has a street driven B20 (actually 2.05 liters) that produces over 300 crank hp and 200 lbs-ft without VVT (old style VTEC). And the car passes emissions as long as the catalytic converter is on it. This is with a _20_ year old engine architecture.
What I'm saying here is that Honda's 7 year old K-series architecture is more than capable of matching the output of Ford's race engine while remaining completely streetable, reliable, and pump gas safe. When it comes to K-series race engines, there is simply no comparison IMO. We've mainly stock part K20s in road racing apps that are making 280 hub hp, in land speed apps that are over 300 hub hp (and nearing 200 mph in a CRX body at 5000 ft elevation naturally aspirated!), and K25 drag engines producing over 400 hub hp. And these are all just enthusiast owned vehicles mostly doing their own work (save machine shop stuff).
Hence, my statement that 280 hp from 2 liters is nothing to be impressed at, especially if its a race engine!
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