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Potenza
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Well I'm not going to bash this car every time it appears, but I just have to say that Concept or Production or otherwise, this thing has no style whatsoever.
I know the current RL, even when it debuted in 2005, wasn't a neck-snapper. But personally I thought it was sharp as hell and that the details were awesome. The first time I saw one I spent about an hour walking around the car at the dealership taking it all in. Here I just don't see anything even worth mentioning.
My dad is now the owner of a 2007 RL. He loves it to death. But he and my brother and I spent less than 5 minutes looking at the RLX in New York. There was nothing to look at, nothing even to say. We simply moved on. When a new Honda concept is on display - never mind a Flagship! - and we family of Honda lovers (including an RL owner) walk past with nothing to say, it can't be good.
I think the fact that people are still to this day confusing the RLX and Accord spy shots, that's a huge mistake on Honda's part. It's fine by me if they use the same plank, but don't rely on the Acura signature grille (formerly known as the Power Plenum) to be the main differentiation. More effort, please. Hell, even the wheels are overly similar.
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NealX
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Wow! I've never seen them compared like that before!
That's a bit ... unnerving.
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sugaki
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What the heck. Wonder if this means the Accord is to the RLX as the Civic is to the ILX--looks like it. Same A-pillar, C-pillar silhouette (though the C-pillar kink is different). Similar looking overall dimensions, overhang. That'd be heinous if that's the case. Judging by Honda as of late, it wouldn't surprise me though.
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Chocs
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sugaki wrote:
What the heck. Wonder if this means the Accord is to the RLX as the Civic is to the ILX--looks like it. Same A-pillar, C-pillar silhouette (though the C-pillar kink is different). Similar looking overall dimensions, overhang. That'd be heinous if that's the case. Judging by Honda as of late, it wouldn't surprise me though.
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silverTL6
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Didn't Honda recently appoint two new global design leads who were supposedly going to shake things up? Specifically, they were going to "make Honda's look sportier, and Acura's more premium".
But if they were the ones responsible for the ILX design, it would make sense that they'd sign off on this bland "jumbo" ILX design.
This gives me no hope for the TLX, regardless of how good it drives with eSH-AWD, direct injection, whatever. Knowing Honda, they will probably also offer it with an Earth Dreams 4-cyl engine :facepalm:
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TurkMan71
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While it makes sense that they have some things in common, they are both sold as Hondas in some places in the world (or use to be), but this comparison!!! Yikes - even the lower profile light catcher on both cars is VERY similar...
Not a good sign.
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montechester
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I'll reserve judgement until I see them side by side WITHOUT all the psuedo paisley camo that is meant to confuse the eye and mask/blend details.
I think you could wrap any 2 sedans in that stuff, with a little well placed cladding/padding, similar wheels, and make them look alike. That camo is very effective compared to the old methods. Even more so in photos compared to seeing it in person.
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Gumbercules
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montechester wrote:
I'll reserve judgement until I see them side by side WITHOUT all the psuedo paisley camo that is meant to confuse the eye and mask/blend details.
I think you could wrap any 2 sedans in that stuff, with a little well placed cladding/padding, similar wheels, and make them look alike. That camo is very effective compared to the old methods. Even more so in photos compared to seeing it in person.
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Yea, I'm not going to say the RLX has great styling, but you could say one is a malibu and the other a 535i and the illusion will still work. Can't really compare with all the camo on.
I'll reserve judgment as well, but I won't hold my breath (the concept did look much better in black though).
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Hondarulez
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IMO, the differences will come from the details and size/road presence. It's hard to tell the difference in size/road presence from photos. And it's also very difficult to look at the details when the cars are under the camouflage tape.
Want to know what similarly looking means? Look no further than the 335i and 535i.
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NickDC5
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Potenza wrote:
I think the fact that people are still to this day confusing the RLX and Accord spy shots, that's a huge mistake on Honda's part.
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I completely agree here, and it's just not something that's ever going to change until Honda just gets up and engineers a new platform, like you mentioned.
It's stuck with those same FWD proportions, which make it:
1. Extremely similar to the Accord
2. Much less aesthetically appealing than its competition with longitudinally-mounted powerplants
There is no simple elegance. The car's just bland. It doesn't need to be overstyled to make up for it (*cough* TL *cough*) but it is understyled and has the skeleton of a less attractive vehicle underneath.
Let's hope the powertrain makes up for the appearance.
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EXV6
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At this point it appears to me that the RLX will look very similar to the Accord. Yes, kinda bland but that might not be a bad thing. I just went back and looked at the RLX concept photos again. It's actually very nice, especially the interior. I'm sure it will look great in person. However, I fear that Acura will overprice it as they did with the now-deceased RL. Imo, pricing more than anything killed the RL. It was an attractive (w/the revised plenium), very competent vehicle but not simply worth the nearly $50k USD price tag. It should have been priced at under $40k. Acura needs to quit trying to be BMW. It is never gonna work. Most potential BMW customers are not going to consider any Acura. They pretty much only cross-shop Mercedes & Audi.
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integrator
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Chocs wrote:
sugaki wrote:
What the heck. Wonder if this means the Accord is to the RLX as the Civic is to the ILX--looks like it. Same A-pillar, C-pillar silhouette (though the C-pillar kink is different). Similar looking overall dimensions, overhang. That'd be heinous if that's the case. Judging by Honda as of late, it wouldn't surprise me though.
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When I see the ILX in person, it doesn't immediately remind me of the Civic... until you see them together. I'm hoping that will be the same with the RLX though it looks soooo close in proportion to the Accord that it might be hard NOT to associate them - a huge mistake for Acura.
As it relates to the two new heads of design: I don't think they would have had much impact on these vehicles (ILX, RDX, RLX). That's a ship thats sailed unfortunately... and I say 'unfortunate' because even highly competent cars get overlook because they're wrapped in bland or unattractive sheet metal. Or even just sheet metal that looks old or not suited for the vehicle's mission.
But what killed the last RL? It wasn't particularly attractive, and the shield has only helped the MDX - disaster for the rest. but more than that... the TL, pricing, and poor product planning/positioning killed the RL. So let's not fool ourselves...unless the next TL is drastically smaller and different, we have the same situation on our hands. Because even with camo, looking at the Concept or patent pics, this car isn't going to be a stunner - in looks or sales. So my question is - how long til they finally wise up and fire Mendel and his cronies ?
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sugaki
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Hondarulez wrote:
Want to know what similarly looking means? Look no further than the 335i and 535i.
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Different front end, taller greenhouse proportionally on the 3 Series (vs near identical on Accord vs RLX), completely different silhouette, More angular character lines vs flat/upright for 5 series.
BMW 5 Series vs 3 Series they have similar features but the fundamental design is different. Acura it's switched. Fundamental design very similar, features different.
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Hondarulez
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sugaki wrote:
Hondarulez wrote:
Want to know what similarly looking means? Look no further than the 335i and 535i.
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Different front end, taller greenhouse proportionally on the 3 Series (vs near identical on Accord vs RLX), completely different silhouette, More angular character lines vs flat/upright for 5 series.
BMW 5 Series vs 3 Series they have similar features but the fundamental design is different. Acura it's switched. Fundamental design very similar, features different.
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Looking at the spy photos, the Accord has a noticeably taller greenhouse proportion as well. The windscreen is sleeker on the RLX. The front end on the RLX is completely different than the Accord.
The thing is, for most consumers, they don't know what greenhouse is. They don't know what silhouelette means. They will simply say, oh hey, the 3 series looks like the 5 series, or the Accord looks like the RLX. They aren't exactly car enthusiasts like us....cover the emblems, and I can see many non car enthusiasts confusing between the 3 series and the 5 series. Even I have trouble determining which car it is on the street unless I actually try. I have no such issue with most other cars.
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Hondarulez
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I can see people confusing the the RLX with the TL though when viewing from the front.
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Hondarulez
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integrator wrote:
Chocs wrote:
sugaki wrote:
What the heck. Wonder if this means the Accord is to the RLX as the Civic is to the ILX--looks like it. Same A-pillar, C-pillar silhouette (though the C-pillar kink is different). Similar looking overall dimensions, overhang. That'd be heinous if that's the case. Judging by Honda as of late, it wouldn't surprise me though.
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When I see the ILX in person, it doesn't immediately remind me of the Civic... until you see them together. I'm hoping that will be the same with the RLX though it looks soooo close in proportion to the Accord that it might be hard NOT to associate them - a huge mistake for Acura.
As it relates to the two new heads of design: I don't think they would have had much impact on these vehicles (ILX, RDX, RLX). That's a ship thats sailed unfortunately... and I say 'unfortunate' because even highly competent cars get overlook because they're wrapped in bland or unattractive sheet metal. Or even just sheet metal that looks old or not suited for the vehicle's mission.
But what killed the last RL? It wasn't particularly attractive, and the shield has only helped the MDX - disaster for the rest. but more than that... the TL, pricing, and poor product planning/positioning killed the RL. So let's not fool ourselves...unless the next TL is drastically smaller and different, we have the same situation on our hands. Because even with camo, looking at the Concept or patent pics, this car isn't going to be a stunner - in looks or sales. So my question is - how long til they finally wise up and fire Mendel and his cronies ?
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Comparing sales numbers from 2005-2011, I think the shield was a disaster for the 4G TL only. The TSX from 2005-2011 has been relatively stable at around 30000-35000 a year. The RDX from 2007-2011 has been stable at around 10000-15000 a year. The ZDX's problems are more than just the shield.
If the TSX is really going away, then I can see the new TL going down in size.
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sugaki
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Hondarulez wrote:
Looking at the spy photos, the Accord has a noticeably taller greenhouse proportion as well. The windscreen is sleeker on the RLX. The front end on the RLX is completely different than the Accord.
Wrong and wrong. From the B-pillar forward the silhouette is identical, superimposing the two it's hard to tell because they match up so perfectly. Windshield, hood cleanly overlap, the wheelbase looks very similar/same. The main difference is the extension of the C-pillar onwards.
Greenhouse on the RLX is more sloped downards. The upright lines on the Accord and the cleaner C-pillar of the Accord, plus the smaller rear overhang make the Accord the better looking of the two. Pathetic for a flagship.
| The thing is, for most consumers, they don't know what greenhouse is. They don't know what silhouelette means. |
Flawed logic. Just because somebody doesn't know what "greenhouse" means doesn't mean they don't feel the visual impact of it. People will see a narrow greenhouse and think "that looks sporty"... without knowing why. Or they'll look at an Acura design and think, "that's a hideous/bland design"--without being able to exactly say why (busy lines, ugly overhang, etc).
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sugaki
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Sorry for double post, the prior post had its formatting messed up.
Hondarulez wrote:
Looking at the spy photos, the Accord has a noticeably taller greenhouse proportion as well. The windscreen is sleeker on the RLX. The front end on the RLX is completely different than the Accord. |
Wrong and wrong. From the B-pillar forward the silhouette is identical, superimposing the two it's hard to tell because they match up so perfectly. Windshield, hood cleanly overlap, the wheelbase looks very similar/same. The main difference is the extension of the C-pillar onwards.
Greenhouse on the RLX is more sloped downards. The upright lines on the Accord and the cleaner C-pillar of the Accord, plus the smaller rear overhang make the Accord the better looking of the two. Pathetic for a flagship.
Hondarulez wrote:
The thing is, for most consumers, they don't know what greenhouse is. They don't know what silhouelette means. |
Flawed logic. Just because somebody doesn't know what "greenhouse" means doesn't mean they don't feel the visual impact of it. People will see a narrow greenhouse and think "that looks sporty"... without knowing why. Or they'll look at an Acura design and think, "that's a hideous/bland design"--without being able to exactly say why (busy lines, ugly overhang, etc).
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Potenza
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Hondarulez wrote:
IMO, the differences will come from the details and size/road presence. It's hard to tell the difference in size/road presence from photos. And it's also very difficult to look at the details when the cars are under the camouflage tape.
Want to know what similarly looking means? Look no further than the 335i and 535i.
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But there should be a much greater differentiation between a $22k+ Honda that sells 400k units a year and a $50k+ Acura that will sell a couple thousand.
Anyway, I posted those comparison pictures, but that was not my main point. The point was that even without camo, there is simply nothing to talk about. This is a car toting the 2015 NSX powertrain!... yet we can't find anything to say about it based on looks. Never mind what's under the camo - we've already seen it. Not just here in these patent pics, but at the beginning of the month when one was spied driving around California with blacked-out taillights. When there's nothing about the car that stands out, you can easily hide in plain sight.
It's funny, because that promo video for the RLX made it appear that it couldn't drive through NYC without everyone breaking their necks to get a look at it. Yet here it drives through California totally undisguised... under the radar. The Flagship of a brand!
I just think if you want to build luxury brand cachet, this is not the way to do it.
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ClementZ
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It has styling. To say otherwise would mean that it's a grey blob at best.
And ouch at the similarities between the Accord and the RLX. Yeah, that's not really a good thing is it...
But then again, what can you expect when you build the two cars on the same platform?
If Honda built an FR platform, or at the very least, a longitudnal FF platform, we wouldn't be having this problem.
This does however, increase my interest in the TLX. The RLX seems to be a carbon copy of the Accord, and the ILX is based off the Accord. What will the TLX be based on?
It won't be the Civic or the Accord, because that would recreate the same space issues that the current RL, TL and TSX suffer from.
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Powered by Honda
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oh god shut up. How long did you spend looking at the 7series?
RLX has same rear lights as the 7er tho.
you's TROLLING.
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DrWhiner
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sugaki wrote:
... the wheelbase looks very similar/same. The main difference is the extension of the C-pillar onwards.
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Powered by Honda
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according to acura the rlx has an all new suspension design double wishbones different then accords.
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Hondarulez
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sugaki wrote:
Sorry for double post, the prior post had its formatting messed up.
Hondarulez wrote:
Looking at the spy photos, the Accord has a noticeably taller greenhouse proportion as well. The windscreen is sleeker on the RLX. The front end on the RLX is completely different than the Accord. |
Wrong and wrong. From the B-pillar forward the silhouette is identical, superimposing the two it's hard to tell because they match up so perfectly. Windshield, hood cleanly overlap, the wheelbase looks very similar/same. The main difference is the extension of the C-pillar onwards.
Greenhouse on the RLX is more sloped downards. The upright lines on the Accord and the cleaner C-pillar of the Accord, plus the smaller rear overhang make the Accord the better looking of the two. Pathetic for a flagship.
Hondarulez wrote:
The thing is, for most consumers, they don't know what greenhouse is. They don't know what silhouelette means. |
Flawed logic. Just because somebody doesn't know what "greenhouse" means doesn't mean they don't feel the visual impact of it. People will see a narrow greenhouse and think "that looks sporty"... without knowing why. Or they'll look at an Acura design and think, "that's a hideous/bland design"--without being able to exactly say why (busy lines, ugly overhang, etc).
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I'm not sure what part I was "wrong and wrong." Looking at the picture from you, the extention of the C-Pillar makes the greenhouse proportion different already. It certainly makes the Accord proportion looks taller (i.e. when you increase length but keeps height the same, obviously the one with the shorter length would look taller).
Now, do we have the exact dimensions of the RLX or Accord yet? Is there any proof that they have the same wheelbase? I'm not too sure if you can figure that out simply by using photoshop and match the wheels of both cars together. I can use photoshop to make all cars to have the same wheelbase.
Whether the RLX is pathetic looking or not is a subjective opinion. I like its styling.
Hmm, not sure why it's flaw logic. But then you proved my point anyway. Definitely, just because greenhouse doesn't mean anything to most people, they can easily feel the visual impact. People might think the Accord looks like the RLX. People might also think the 3 and 5 look alike as well.
Again, I'm not saying the Accord doesn't look like the RLX. It's just that I feel the 3 series looks a lot like the 5 series as well. And we don't exactly have to go into too much detail to see it.
As Potenza said, it's not so much of a problem for BMW if the 3 series looks like the 5 series, as some 3 series can cost as much as a 5 series (although I'm not sure how the 550i owner would think when his $80k car looks like the $40k 328i!) as they are both from BMW. The RLX has to look different than the Accord on the other hand as one is a flagship while the other one is a bread & butter family sedan. Sure, their overall shape are kind of similar, but we have yet to see the other design features and I don't think we can really make a fair judgement until we see both cars in production forms.
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Potenza
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Hondarulez wrote:
Now, do we have the exact dimensions of the RLX or Accord yet? Is there any proof that they have the same wheelbase?
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Dimensionally, the RLX Concept is approximately the same length as the current RL, but with a two-inch longer wheelbase.
Current RL: 110.2 inches. Plus two = 112.2 inches.
A shortened wheelbase and reduced weight will also give the 2013 Accord Sedan more responsive handling and improved driving dynamics.
Current Accord: 110.2 inches. Minus a bit = less than 110 inches
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Hondarulez
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Potenza wrote:
Hondarulez wrote:
Now, do we have the exact dimensions of the RLX or Accord yet? Is there any proof that they have the same wheelbase?
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Dimensionally, the RLX Concept is approximately the same length as the current RL, but with a two-inch longer wheelbase.
Current RL: 110.2 inches. Plus two = 112.2 inches.
A shortened wheelbase and reduced weight will also give the 2013 Accord Sedan more responsive handling and improved driving dynamics.
Current Accord: 110.2 inches. Minus a bit = less than 110 inches
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Thanks a lot!
Assuming 2" less for the Accord, that would be a 4" difference.
For comparison, the wheelbase on the current Accord is 5" longer than the current Civic's. And the wheelbase on the TSX is 1.4" more than the wheelbase on the Civic.
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