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TOV Forums > General Talk > > Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?

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DrWhiner
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Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 00:59
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Nick Graves wrote:
Interesting points.

It IS possible to make money at low volume, using 'soft' tooling & the like. Especially if one factors in the rather nebulous 'halo' effect.

If you look at the way the germans spin off all sorts of daft, low-volume variants (I still cannot understand the point of having C & E-class versions of the same coupe!) one may better understand the logic.

Anyway, hopefully the 86 will be a great, involving drive & a success. It's about the only modern production car I'm interested in.

But the subject of the discussion is an 'affordable' sports car that starts from $25k, not the luxo 'premium' (whatever it means) 2 dr. Too bad, there are prob. more buyers willing to pay for the 'premium' look at me too 2 dr, rather than an affordabke fun car.
owequitit
Profile for owequitit
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 01:04
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danielgr wrote:
owequitit wrote:
danielgr wrote:
Jovian8 wrote:
Honda could easily build a FT86 competitor...
but it wont.

For some strange reason, sporty cars are abandoned
and Crossover & hybrid sectors are pursued.
... and I gotta say they are doing badly in those sectors except for the CR-V which is a good car.
On its more than 50years of history Honda has never built a compact-class RWD coupe despite all the voices claiming for it, so no, sporty cars have never been abandoned, Honda has simply never made the kind of car you guys are asking for.

Honda's answer to such cars have always been the same one: within that level of power/weight LSD-enhanced FWD compact coupes are more than able to cope with any RWD car in any circumstance, while delivering greater value, roominess, safety and all-weather performance; the current Si lives up to that formula, though obviously it's not the most hardcore incarnation they've done (and the US has rarely see those hardcore incarnations, which may also have been why the aftermarket has developed so much...). Honda has also usually alternated more hardcore models with more watered-down ones, so that ain't new either. And yes, everytime there has been a more hardcore model there have also been people that wished Honda offered an easier to live-with version in exchange for some ultimate-performance. To me at least it's only natural not offering "more of the same" every time; it's much easier to please people on 10y cycles than in 5.

Personally, I doubt the FT-86 will offer much more to the hardcore enthusiasts than a well-maintained and properly tuned 8th gen Si could, but I do recognize it ain't my field of expertise (here I'm asking for Shawn opinion).

Back to the FT-86, for decades there have been people complaining about the lack of such car in the Honda portfolio (ever since TOV exists at the very least), and it does seem that those voices will never cease.

I'm personally fine with people asking for what they want, just don't make it seem as if Honda not making it was something new. No need to be "a victim of modern times" when you can be an "ethernal victim", and instead be pleased by a reliable Japanese maker to finally making the car you want, regardless of what Honda does or doesn't. And again, the best thing you guys could do to let Honda know is not complaining in a forum but buying an FT-86, the more the better. The worst thing that could happen to you is if after all the hype the FT doesn't sell, 'cause I'm pretty sure if it does Honda will bring something to fight back; they always do (as much as Toyota does when Honda breaks some ground with a new model).




S500/S600/S800

S2000

Beat

ALL compact class RWD cars. Not coupes but "sports" cars nonetheless.

In fact, contrary to your assertion, the S was the FIRST car they ever put into production, and they certainly were building sports cars and "sporty" cars (Prelude, Si, CRX Si, NSX) long before they were building hippy-happy hybrids, monstrous SUV's, minivans, hulking hatchback Crosstours, and boxes on wheels with plastic sides. Their first car was in fact RWD, it was compact, and it was a sports car. So in their 50 years, they most certainly have built them, even if they weren't fixed roof.


Thanks owe but mind you, by now you should know at least I know the basic history of Honda and avoid playing with my words. I obviously used the word "compact coupe" as referring to a mainstream coupe in the us compact segment (selling in the 20k bracket and with a broad appeal) The S series are specialty cars that have nothing to do in this conversation on the FT-86, nor could any of them be considered as an answer to it.
The beat is a 660cc MR car, which as a concept has more in common with an NSX than anything else.

So really, just go back on topic before discussing for the sake of it and picking word in a sense you know is wrong. No civic Si could be an S2000 substitute, nor the opposite.

Now, once again, all you guys have to do is simple: buy the FT if it does embody what you are looking for in a car. Honda never made a CrossTour because of a happy idea, they did it because they saw Venza sales and thought people are ready to pay for such car. Now have a look at the 370z (arguably the best Z ever by a healthy margin) numbers and it's easy to understand why they are not going there. Personally, I believe that even the image of the "performance enthusiast" as they guy whose compliments would help drive sales and create a positive aura around the brand is fading, maybe faster than some would like it too

Again, I hope Honda brings some nice present for you guys, but that's likely to be that, a present, or a specialty car if you want, and I sure hope when they do it's not an answer to the FT, because I really see nothing "special" about it (and I'm using the word special as in the s2000). And again, to me the answer to that type of car has always be and will always be something along the lines of the current Si or the old preludes / integras.



I also know the basic history of Honda and did NOT play with your words. Honda's first car was a "compact" RWD sports car. The S2K was also a compact RWD sports car.

If you have ever seen either of these two cars, then you would know they were both compact sports cars. I didn't twist anything. Your statement was blatantly false.
Nick GravesX
Profile for Nick GravesX
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 06:07
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DrWhiner wrote:
Nick Graves wrote:
Interesting points.

It IS possible to make money at low volume, using 'soft' tooling & the like. Especially if one factors in the rather nebulous 'halo' effect.

If you look at the way the germans spin off all sorts of daft, low-volume variants (I still cannot understand the point of having C & E-class versions of the same coupe!) one may better understand the logic.

Anyway, hopefully the 86 will be a great, involving drive & a success. It's about the only modern production car I'm interested in.

But the subject of the discussion is an 'affordable' sports car that starts from $25k, not the luxo 'premium' (whatever it means) 2 dr. Too bad, there are prob. more buyers willing to pay for the 'premium' look at me too 2 dr, rather than an affordabke fun car.



The principle still works at a lower price point - admittedly the numbers are tighter.

Cf. the MG RV8; there was a car made of replacement parts! BMW were very impressed and looked at doing a 2002 sequel on a similar basis, but there was a problem that precluded it. So they invented the 1er instead.

It's certainly possible to be profitable at low volumes, but it's got to be calculated right. Most big-volume businesses simply CBA.
Grace141
Profile for Grace141
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 07:06
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Nick Graves wrote:
DrWhiner wrote:
Nick Graves wrote:
Interesting points.

It IS possible to make money at low volume, using 'soft' tooling & the like. Especially if one factors in the rather nebulous 'halo' effect.

If you look at the way the germans spin off all sorts of daft, low-volume variants (I still cannot understand the point of having C & E-class versions of the same coupe!) one may better understand the logic.

Anyway, hopefully the 86 will be a great, involving drive & a success. It's about the only modern production car I'm interested in.

But the subject of the discussion is an 'affordable' sports car that starts from $25k, not the luxo 'premium' (whatever it means) 2 dr. Too bad, there are prob. more buyers willing to pay for the 'premium' look at me too 2 dr, rather than an affordabke fun car.



The principle still works at a lower price point - admittedly the numbers are tighter.

Cf. the MG RV8; there was a car made of replacement parts! BMW were very impressed and looked at doing a 2002 sequel on a similar basis, but there was a problem that precluded it. So they invented the 1er instead.

It's certainly possible to be profitable at low volumes, but it's got to be calculated right. Most big-volume businesses simply CBA.


The MGRV8 was an excellent marketing exercise for gauging interest in the MG name but not even BMW could save Rover.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/mg-sports-cars9.htm

The program more or less amounted to taking a ten year old MGB, updating it with fresh styling, dropping an existing V8 engine under the hood, and increasing the price it had last sold for twelve years earlier by 5x. It was a massive failure even if it sold in the numbers projected. It's a prime example of a car people wanted to buy at the price asked and yet the company couldn't cost it correctly. I'm convinced BMW stepped in to buy Rover cars only to take the Range Rover 4wd tech for the X5 and to take the Mini Cooper program which was designed and prepared for launch by Rover.

I'm also convinced that Mazda could make the Miata work only when they were selling 323's and 626's. With the failure of the 6 as well as the RX8 in the US I'm curious how long we'll continue to have the Miata. It's possible the Miata money appears to work simply because they sell so few of them. RWD sports cars were profitable back in the day because they did share platforms and parts with the regular sedans and wagons. Alfa is the best example of this with its Berlina sedans. This doesn't work for the FRS/BRZ.

The only way I see the BRZ program being successful is if it quickly goes upmarket with performance options. An FR-S TRD model (a better name is badly needed) with a huge bump in HP and priced at $30k US would help.
RocketRon
Profile for RocketRon
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 07:56
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BlackSeries wrote:
RSX wrote:

Okay, someone needs to do a comparison of the ITR to the Subota. It's too intriguing not to.


BRZ
http://tinyurl.com/BRZFRS86
0-30 2.3
0-40 3.4
0-50 4.8
0-60 6.4
0-70 8.4
0-80 10.5
0-90 13.2
0-100 16.4
QUARTER MILE: 14.9 sec @ 95.5 mph
BRAKING: 60-0 MPH 120 ft
Lateral acceleration, 0.90g
EPA fuel economy: 22/30
CURB WEIGHT 2747 lb

ITR
http://tinyurl.com/AITRFWD
0-30 mph 2.6
0-40 mph 3.8
0-50 mph 4.9
0-60 mph 6.2
0-70 mph 8.1
0-80 mph 10.1
0-90 mph 12.8
Quarter mile 14.8secs @ 96.3mph
Braking: 60-0 mph 115 ft
Lateral acceleration, 0.92g
EPA fuel economy: 25/30
Curb weight: 2639 lb




Hmm....Not much difference, all I can see is, ITR is still more desirable.





Honda Civic Si (2006-2011)
0-30 mph 2.4
0-40 mph 3.5
0-50 mph 4.8
0-60 mph 6.3
0-70 mph 8.2
0-80 mph 10.5
0-90 mph 13.4
Quarter mile 14.9secs @ 94.7mph
Braking: 60-0 mph 117 ft
Lateral acceleration, 0.89g
EPA fuel economy: 22/31
Curb weight: 2871 lb

Source: http://www.motortrend.com/roadtests/coupes/112_0606_midsize_coupe_comparision/specs_pricing.html
Nick GravesX
Profile for Nick GravesX
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 08:03
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Grace141 wrote:
Nick Graves wrote:
DrWhiner wrote:
Nick Graves wrote:
Interesting points.

It IS possible to make money at low volume, using 'soft' tooling & the like. Especially if one factors in the rather nebulous 'halo' effect.

If you look at the way the germans spin off all sorts of daft, low-volume variants (I still cannot understand the point of having C & E-class versions of the same coupe!) one may better understand the logic.

Anyway, hopefully the 86 will be a great, involving drive & a success. It's about the only modern production car I'm interested in.

But the subject of the discussion is an 'affordable' sports car that starts from $25k, not the luxo 'premium' (whatever it means) 2 dr. Too bad, there are prob. more buyers willing to pay for the 'premium' look at me too 2 dr, rather than an affordabke fun car.



The principle still works at a lower price point - admittedly the numbers are tighter.

Cf. the MG RV8; there was a car made of replacement parts! BMW were very impressed and looked at doing a 2002 sequel on a similar basis, but there was a problem that precluded it. So they invented the 1er instead.

It's certainly possible to be profitable at low volumes, but it's got to be calculated right. Most big-volume businesses simply CBA.


The MGRV8 was an excellent marketing exercise for gauging interest in the MG name but not even BMW could save Rover.

http://auto.howstuffworks.com/mg-sports-cars9.htm

The program more or less amounted to taking a ten year old MGB, updating it with fresh styling, dropping an existing V8 engine under the hood, and increasing the price it had last sold for twelve years earlier by 5x. It was a massive failure even if it sold in the numbers projected. It's a prime example of a car people wanted to buy at the price asked and yet the company couldn't cost it correctly. I'm convinced BMW stepped in to buy Rover cars only to take the Range Rover 4wd tech for the X5 and to take the Mini Cooper program which was designed and prepared for launch by Rover.

I'm also convinced that Mazda could make the Miata work only when they were selling 323's and 626's. With the failure of the 6 as well as the RX8 in the US I'm curious how long we'll continue to have the Miata. It's possible the Miata money appears to work simply because they sell so few of them. RWD sports cars were profitable back in the day because they did share platforms and parts with the regular sedans and wagons. Alfa is the best example of this with its Berlina sedans. This doesn't work for the FRS/BRZ.

The only way I see the BRZ program being successful is if it quickly goes upmarket with performance options. An FR-S TRD model (a better name is badly needed) with a huge bump in HP and priced at $30k US would help.



The point is; the car was made from the heritage spare parts operation with a few new components - front subframe, 911 headlights, new interior/wings/bumpers etc. Hence BMW were interested if they could to likewise. IIRC, the shape of the BMW's classic front was too wrong to pass modern safety tests without expensive modification, which rather ruined the classic look too so rendered it pointless.

It was also a case that BMW didn't want to dilute its own brand image by producing SUVs. They soon realised they didn't need Land Rover after all & whored-out their own brand.

What killed the whole thing really was currency movements; BMW couldn't make a profit out of Rover because of Sterling appreciation. They had to kick it in the head before it ruined BMW too. ATEOTD, MINI gave them the size they needed not to be taken over & the profit they made flogging the other bits meant it wasn't such a waste after all.

It'll be interesting to see what happens with the MX-5, once the reality of global bankruptcy hits. I expect Mazda will try to hang onto it, because it's their only interesting product in a very boring fleet.

Ditto the BRZ.

Just be thankful they make such cars by buying one! No point in people whining they don't make sports cars if they never $$$ up for one.

I hope we aren't left all driving Nissan Cubes designed according to the whims of the Gen-Ys distilled by market researchers down to the lowest-common denominator.
RocketRon
Profile for RocketRon
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 11:15
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I forgot too mention that in the process of comparing the 2006-2011 Si performance numbers with the Subayota and ITR, let's not forget why the Si is heavier. Luxury items (like power moonroof), a balancer shaft (for increased longevity at the cost of 5 HP) and superior cargo capacity.

Despite the fact that these daily driving advantages add extra weight, the Si performance numbers are very comparable.


DrWhiner
Profile for DrWhiner
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 17:57
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Nick Graves wrote:
The principle still works at a lower price point - admittedly the numbers are tighter.

Cf. the MG RV8; there was a car made of replacement parts! BMW were very impressed and looked at doing a 2002 sequel on a similar basis, but there was a problem that precluded it. So they invented the 1er instead.

It's certainly possible to be profitable at low volumes, but it's got to be calculated right. Most big-volume businesses simply CBA.

According to the web page from Grace, it was still a $40,000 car (without features like power assists and anti-lock brakes) back in 90s, it was not a BRZ/FR-S.
DrWhiner
Profile for DrWhiner
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 18:02
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Forgot to add:

According to HowStuffWorks: "One day, two British enthusiasts stumbled upon 1000 tons of original B tooling, including jigs and dies for making complete bodies. Rover was only too happy to sell, so the pair bought the lot and founded British Motor Heritage to serve dedicated B-keepers under Rover auspices."

So, straightly speaking, it was not a product from Rover.

Lastly, not even the Brits wanted it, as "half went to Japan".
Grace141
Profile for Grace141
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 18:25
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DrWhiner wrote:
Forgot to add:

According to HowStuffWorks: "One day, two British enthusiasts stumbled upon 1000 tons of original B tooling, including jigs and dies for making complete bodies. Rover was only too happy to sell, so the pair bought the lot and founded British Motor Heritage to serve dedicated B-keepers under Rover auspices."

So, straightly speaking, it was not a product from Rover.

Lastly, not even the Brits wanted it, as "half went to Japan".


I'm happy they did form BMH because I've been sending them money. The story goes they found the MGB dies sitting in the rain in a lockup lot behind a warehouse.

http://www.bmh-ltd.com/company.htm

BMH sells body shells and parts for the original cars. Rover built the MGRV8 off a modified B platform using new panels.

Bottom line is you can build a brand new 40 year old sports car for about $20k US using new and used parts on a new shell but with no safety features beyond seat belts. That $24k US base price on the FR-S/BRZ seems very reasonable and about where the base Miata is.
A77
Profile for A77
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 22:59
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Grace141 wrote:
DrWhiner wrote:
Forgot to add:

According to HowStuffWorks: "One day, two British enthusiasts stumbled upon 1000 tons of original B tooling, including jigs and dies for making complete bodies. Rover was only too happy to sell, so the pair bought the lot and founded British Motor Heritage to serve dedicated B-keepers under Rover auspices."

So, straightly speaking, it was not a product from Rover.

Lastly, not even the Brits wanted it, as "half went to Japan".


I'm happy they did form BMH because I've been sending them money. The story goes they found the MGB dies sitting in the rain in a lockup lot behind a warehouse.

http://www.bmh-ltd.com/company.htm

BMH sells body shells and parts for the original cars. Rover built the MGRV8 off a modified B platform using new panels.

Bottom line is you can build a brand new 40 year old sports car for about $20k US using new and used parts on a new shell but with no safety features beyond seat belts. That $24k US base price on the FR-S/BRZ seems very reasonable and about where the base Miata is.



My God, BMH is based in Witney - where my grandmother used to live - only previous claim to fame was Pam Ayres...only Nick would have any idea who I am talking about.....fortunately for everyone....
sadlerau
Profile for sadlerau
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 23:35
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Pam Ayres was an acquired taste. Australia always was an extension of British culture, though that has now changed, mostly.
A77
Profile for A77
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-27-2012 23:45
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I stand corrected.....

I found Australia still surprisingly British in its TV programming....way way more than Canada. Also found your news programs amazingly unparochial compared to most (all?) north american. I mean there was decent international coverage. digressing a bit here

Least Australia drives on the correct side of the road.....
NSXman
Profile for NSXman
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-28-2012 03:01
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I always thought an RX-8 type vehicle from Honda with a high revving 4 (or gasp, a turbo-4) would be a cool follow-up to the S2000. I know the purists will say high revving 4, but I am just thinking any RWD follow-up here from Honda.

Nick GravesX
Profile for Nick GravesX
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-28-2012 05:22
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BRZs, Pam Ayres, RV8s.

The definition of a true sports car is it breeds interesting & vaired threads. The BRZ passes the test.

Far less dull than endlessly discussing Civic quarterlights!

The BMH operation has expanded & parts are available of a huge range of collectable old British iron. Be warned though; the tooling is worn & the shells are even worse than when the cars were in producton - much hand fettling required to get the shuts tidy.
Grace141
Profile for Grace141
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-28-2012 13:47
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Talk of British sports cars can come down to whether you appreciate the irony of positive earth, I guess, but at least this BRZ thing looks like a proper sports GT provided the back seat arrangement is truly uncomfortable and it looks like it is. I think the BRZ is too big but then I thought the S2K had too much power to be a sports car. There is no way you can drive an S2K at full dash on public roads for very long without ending up in the cooler.

Nick GravesX
Profile for Nick GravesX
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-29-2012 05:52
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Yes you can! Mostly using VTEC in 2nd gear out of corners & generally behaving like a hooligan on back roads. It's what the car was made for.

I do accept the point though; finding the sort of roads to stretch the NSX is difficult. Fortunately it's a great cruiser.

You have to wring its neck a lot of the time, but basically the Prelude is a good balance of power to weight & the short gearing means brisk acceleration for 200 BHP in a 1.3 tonne car.

Thus, the BRZ ought to be a good compromise.

I really don't get the point of all these silly AMG M-Bs in the UK.
MasterOfDaDomain
Profile for MasterOfDaDomain
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-29-2012 15:30
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Dan Neil has reviewed the BRZ on WSJ.

I agree with him about the purpose of the car - not to be really fast, but to feel fast and fun.

I think it's the right sports car for the suburban/urban Joe.

I want one.
NSXman
Profile for NSXman
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-30-2012 00:38
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Nick Graves wrote:
Yes you can! Mostly using VTEC in 2nd gear out of corners & generally behaving like a hooligan on back roads. It's what the car was made for.

I do accept the point though; finding the sort of roads to stretch the NSX is difficult. Fortunately it's a great cruiser.

You have to wring its neck a lot of the time, but basically the Prelude is a good balance of power to weight & the short gearing means brisk acceleration for 200 BHP in a 1.3 tonne car.

Thus, the BRZ ought to be a good compromise.

I really don't get the point of all these silly AMG M-Bs in the UK.



Unless you are Jeremy Clarkson who can drive his AMG MB on the Top Gear test track.
Nick GravesX
Profile for Nick GravesX
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-30-2012 07:33
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NSXman wrote:
Nick Graves wrote:
Yes you can! Mostly using VTEC in 2nd gear out of corners & generally behaving like a hooligan on back roads. It's what the car was made for.

I do accept the point though; finding the sort of roads to stretch the NSX is difficult. Fortunately it's a great cruiser.

You have to wring its neck a lot of the time, but basically the Prelude is a good balance of power to weight & the short gearing means brisk acceleration for 200 BHP in a 1.3 tonne car.

Thus, the BRZ ought to be a good compromise.

I really don't get the point of all these silly AMG M-Bs in the UK.



Unless you are Jeremy Clarkson who can drive his AMG MB on the Top Gear test track.



I don't get many miles out of my rear tyres, but even I'm not that cruel!

Now the TG Test track & a BRZ/my S2000...

I can reverse off the track like a total arse with only 197/237 bhp quite nicely, thank you.
ezshift5
Profile for ezshift5
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-30-2012 13:23
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.........enthusiastic video test drive............

thanks, ez
fasthonda
Profile for fasthonda
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-31-2012 06:06
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NO! Honda certainly doesn't have an answer to the FT-86.
A number of people have made reference to certain Honda cars(that have been discontinued)as being competitors.I believe that's not relevant simply because Honda at this point of time is NOT producing a RWD light sports coupe!
Sure the Civic SI may be a competitor however,I have a feeling that the Civic may not have performance/handling ability around the track as the FT-86.
If Subaru bring out a STI version....it will be game over for the Civic.
superchg2
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Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-31-2012 11:47
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fasthonda wrote:
NO! Honda certainly doesn't have an answer to the FT-86.
A number of people have made reference to certain Honda cars(that have been discontinued)as being competitors.I believe that's not relevant simply because Honda at this point of time is NOT producing a RWD light sports coupe!
Sure the Civic SI may be a competitor however,I have a feeling that the Civic may not have performance/handling ability around the track as the FT-86.
If Subaru bring out a STI version....it will be game over for the Civic.


I will just have to continue suffering with my '06 Si. (sigh)
Nick GravesX
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Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-31-2012 12:30
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fasthonda wrote:
NO! Honda certainly doesn't have an answer to the FT-86.
A number of people have made reference to certain Honda cars(that have been discontinued)as being competitors.I believe that's not relevant simply because Honda at this point of time is NOT producing a RWD light sports coupe!
Sure the Civic SI may be a competitor however,I have a feeling that the Civic may not have performance/handling ability around the track as the FT-86.
If Subaru bring out a STI version....it will be game over for the Civic.



Exactly the point.

Hereinafter referred to as Temple of Hachiroku
330R
Profile for 330R
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-31-2012 20:32
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Nick Graves wrote:
Exactly the point.

Hereinafter referred to as Temple of Hachiroku



You know, an 86/GT-86/FR-S/BRZ subforum would be pretty cool to have here. We could put news items, factory and aftermarket parts release info, new and prospective owners can post here on TOV while staying to keep up on all the latest Honda enthusiast news Earth Dreams and new model release news. I'm willing to bet there will be some numbers of Honda fans picking up a Sciotabaru.

It might get the attention of those Honda corporate lurkers, as well.
NealX
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Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-31-2012 20:57
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"Earth Dreams..."
Jovian8
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Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-31-2012 21:36
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Neal what are you smokin' ?

330R
Profile for 330R
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-31-2012 21:38
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[URL=http://s446.photobucket.com/albums/qq189/330R_photo/?action=view¤t=032308_Malaysia_Buttonpitstop_large-1.jpg][/URL]
330R
Profile for 330R
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-31-2012 21:39
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Well that went about as well as the car...
DCR
Profile for DCR
Re: Does Honda have an answer to the FT-86?    (Score: 1, Normal) 03-31-2012 22:04
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img tags!

 
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