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HONDA AFVM
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No mention if the A/C is electric and will continue to function when the Idle stop engages???? It would kind of suck if the A/C is like that in the CRZ and Insight........Stops working.......
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Potenza
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HONDA AFVM wrote:
No mention if the A/C is electric and will continue to function when the Idle stop engages????
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When Hyundai introduced their new in-house 6AT, in came in a very detailed writeup, and I was impressed by the increases in efficiency with decreases in weight over the 5AT, given numerically. With Honda's (Acura's) first 6AT... no information at all. Same with idle stop. I'm interested to know how it works and compares technically to other manufacturer's systems. You would think Honda would be the first company to brag about its engineering of various systems.
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HONDA AFVM
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Potenza wrote:
HONDA AFVM wrote:
No mention if the A/C is electric and will continue to function when the Idle stop engages????
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When Hyundai introduced their new in-house 6AT, in came in a very detailed writeup, and I was impressed by the increases in efficiency with decreases in weight over the 5AT, given numerically. With Honda's (Acura's) first 6AT... no information at all. Same with idle stop. I'm interested to know how it works and compares technically to other manufacturer's systems. You would think Honda would be the first company to brag about its engineering of various systems.
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It kills me how Honda lacks in explaining it's stuff.......So much, I just ate a HUGE plate of Sushi in protest...........LOL.........all joking aside, and I did have Sushi, but I really don't get it......but they are SO AFRAID that someone will steal their technology......Like GM can whip up this in 4 months........they can't even build an electric car for god sake...........
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JeffX
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HONDA AFVM wrote:
No mention if the A/C is electric and will continue to function when the Idle stop engages???? It would kind of suck if the A/C is like that in the CRZ and Insight........Stops working.......
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yeah it's going to stop working. this is a normal petrol engine with no electric assist. it's just like automatically twisting the ignition off when you roll to a stop and then firing the engine back on when you're ready to go. As I understand it, this is how most of the non-Hybrid idle-stop cars work in Europe. That means it's also more of a jarring type of start as opposed to the nearly seamless auto-start you get with IMA hybrids.
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P54
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Over the years Honda, its importers, distributors and dealers have been so fortunate they could sell a brand that customers wanted, was sometimes in short supply and dealers asked several thousand dollars above MSRP.
During those years and still, other brands had press releases to newspapers and other magazines explaining their "new inventions" or technologies. Many times those "news" were just marketing gimmick, of little value or new technology for the brand that caused a lot of problems down the road. Meanwhile Honda had been using similar technology for years, yet people did not know and Honda did not have the problems other brands got themselves into. Even the Honda dealers themselves do not know how the Honda was different from other brands, they just sold them. How often did they open the hood to see and point out to customers the difference between Honda and others. Today many of those differences are not so much there anymore as competition have followed in Honda's footsteps in many areas.
Whether in USA or Europe it seems Honda is reluctant to feed media with information they use, whether it is because other brands treat the media better or Honda is not giving the media the information I do not know. Local magazines with "car stuff" in them seldom have anything about Honda, however Ford, Chevy, Audi, Volvo, VW, Hyundai, Toyota etc. all have some propaganda going.
Today we are told 5 speed, non DI and non turbo is "old tech", however even so Honda is competitive, even leading in performance and FE. Yet media swallow all the hype from press releases and fail to see that in the real world they fail to deliver as promised. But they still keep bashing Honda. All the FE gains promised by Hyundai, Ford and Chevy etc. with their Turbo's, 6 speed, DI and new transmissions seems to be more on paper than in the real world.
When did Honda ever market their products for their technology, the product itself or even close to the product. Usually it is something else they market and try to get peoples attention and emotions involved for only to put the name Honda in there at the end. Or they have a silly cartoon. I'm sure AHM spends millions of dollar in worthless marketing. Too much "its a Honda" instead of what a Honda is. I guess many times the customer knows more about the Honda they buy than the dealer himself, they are used to the easy sell, not realizing why many choose to buy Honda in the first place.
Dealers and others can educate themselves if they want:
http://world.honda.com/products/index.html
http://world.honda.com/automobile-technology/
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P54
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Here is more about idle stop on Honda bikes, if of any interest:
http://world.honda.com/motorcycle-picturebook/idling-stop/
More details found here and the principle of operation might be same for cars? 5 pages with all you need to know. Honda says it starts engine quiet and jolt free, starts moving smoothly.
http://world.honda.com/motorcycle-technology/Engineidlingstop/index.html
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CarPhreakD
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The motorbike idle stop is very much like Mazda's in the sense that the crank is positioned so that very little is needed to set the engine off again.
My main concern with idle stop is that it's currently not a reliable system; generally speaking, the constant discharge cycle experienced by idle stop systems degrades the vehicle's lead acid batteries by a large amount. BMW's earliest systems measured the life of the battery, and reduces idle stop when it detects battery degradation... so what people found was their car didn't do idle stop at all after TWO WEEKS of ownership.
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HONDA AFVM
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Jeff wrote:
HONDA AFVM wrote:
No mention if the A/C is electric and will continue to function when the Idle stop engages???? It would kind of suck if the A/C is like that in the CRZ and Insight........Stops working.......
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yeah it's going to stop working. this is a normal petrol engine with no electric assist. it's just like automatically twisting the ignition off when you roll to a stop and then firing the engine back on when you're ready to go. As I understand it, this is how most of the non-Hybrid idle-stop cars work in Europe. That means it's also more of a jarring type of start as opposed to the nearly seamless auto-start you get with IMA hybrids.
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No thanks.....I see no reason for a small 2kWh pack that can run the A/C. Electric A/C is more efficient, less weight and not that much more expensive in the long run.........
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montechester
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Potenza wrote:
Companies like Ford, Hyundai, Mazda, BMW... heck, most if not all of them... often put out a big press release on each "new" technology. Which I find interesting and very informative. But Honda is lacking here.
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Actually, Honda tends to put a lot of the technical detail and drawings/diagrams showing the inner workings of systems in the Press Kit once the vehicle nears its on sale date. Also, they seem to consider the customer base expectations for each vehicle and obviously give more detail on an S2000 or NSX than a pedestrian Civic or Accord.
I know I've said it before, but take a look at Hondanews.com for more detailed explanations and technical drawings of vehicles as they get close to being on dealer lots, not 3+ months in advance.
Why should they tell the competition how they are doing everything at least until their product is in the market? I wouldn't...
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Potenza
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montechester wrote:
Potenza wrote:
Companies like Ford, Hyundai, Mazda, BMW... heck, most if not all of them... often put out a big press release on each "new" technology. Which I find interesting and very informative. But Honda is lacking here.
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Actually, Honda tends to put a lot of the technical detail and drawings/diagrams showing the inner workings of systems in the Press Kit once the vehicle nears its on sale date. Also, they seem to consider the customer base expectations for each vehicle and obviously give more detail on an S2000 or NSX than a pedestrian Civic or Accord.
I know I've said it before, but take a look at Hondanews.com for more detailed explanations and technical drawings of vehicles as they get close to being on dealer lots, not 3+ months in advance.
Why should they tell the competition how they are doing everything at least until their product is in the market? I wouldn't...
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CarPhreakD
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HONDA AFVM wrote:
Jeff wrote:
HONDA AFVM wrote:
No mention if the A/C is electric and will continue to function when the Idle stop engages???? It would kind of suck if the A/C is like that in the CRZ and Insight........Stops working.......
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yeah it's going to stop working. this is a normal petrol engine with no electric assist. it's just like automatically twisting the ignition off when you roll to a stop and then firing the engine back on when you're ready to go. As I understand it, this is how most of the non-Hybrid idle-stop cars work in Europe. That means it's also more of a jarring type of start as opposed to the nearly seamless auto-start you get with IMA hybrids.
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No thanks.....I see no reason for a small 2kWh pack that can run the A/C. Electric A/C is more efficient, less weight and not that much more expensive in the long run.........
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Right, but the main thing that some automakers are leery of are the failure modes. If you have a mechanical water pump/AC unit and it "fails", you still at least get a bit of an effect from both because they're forced to run.
If an electric pump or AC fails, you're SOL, because they simply stop working. AC isn't such a big deal, but the main thing to be leery about is non-functioning electric water pump. Most companies that employ electric water pumps use one or two main ones, and a few auxiliary ones (i.e. the afterrun pump for turbocharged engines), and the engine is designed to go into limp mode when one of the main pumps fail.
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